Sandy Bates: Crestwood All-Sports Boosters have posters for all kinds of events, and I would like to ask if you can hang them someplace. This is to support the kids in their sporting functions. We will do it again in the fall.
Also, when you were talking about the offices needing room, my son was in the last class that went there [to the Center School]. There is a principal's office and a secretary's office which would be fine. We [Blogger: the co-op preschool which has been told to vacate the trailer on the west side of the school building] have some cabinets we are willing to let officers use.
When you are looking at costs, moving the Historical Society would cost money and so would tearing out the stage [in the Civic Center].
Also--why do you call the gymnasium the annex?
Jason: It was built in the '60's.
Sandy: That was the oldest running school in the state of Ohio.
One last thing: On the bell [which was retrieved from the Village], whoever did it--I do not understand why it was painted. Is it a bronze or brass bell? [Blogger: There was some input from Larry about this, since he had done the work on it. He said that brass turns green, so the bell had to be coated. As I understand it, the coating changes the color and luster. Sandy said, "Like the Statue of Liberty." If I remember correctly, Larry agreed. Me, again: The Statue of Liberty is copper sheathed, I believe. I have not had time to investigate the properties of metals to satisfy my curiosity and perhaps Sandy's.]
Dan Cozzens: The heating system at the school--are rooms independently heated?
Vic: Each room has its own thermostat. In the gymnasium it is a completely different heating system.
Larry Leitzow: Is there any asbestos or lead paint in the old school? [Blogger: At this point, Larry having asked this question a number of times, always having gotten the same answer, my tolerance was stretched too far and I said, "No. I have the reports." Larry told me to control myself, I told him to do the same, and Vic answered the question.]
Vic: We have not found any to this point. Vic explained how the school was inspected. Every item was checked and every item had been abated in the early '90's. No asbestos was found in the ceiling. Vic had a receipt for the disposal facility where what had been removed was handled.
At 10:13 there was a motion to pay the bills. An executive session was to follow. Your blogger did not stay for that, and neither did the video camera.
Sunday, April 29, 2012
Wednesday, April 25, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees, 4-19-12, Pt. 3
Introductory Note: Earlier in the meeting, Vic mentioned a letter he had received and asked about dealing with it. Jason commented that he had not intended to; that they had all received the same e-mail; and that if Vic wanted to bring it up, that was OK. Vic riffled through his folder and said that it could come under New Business. Part of this post is the letter which Vic read, and part of it is the response to it.
Vic: We received a letter. Some names have been named here in this letter and I think we should address it.
The topics are the Land Use Committee, All Boards, and [a demand to] remove some Zoning members.
Blogger: The letter is given below.
From: Dawn Pechman [dawnpechman@windstream.net]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 6:29 PM
To: 'Jason Carlton'; 'John Festa'
Subject: Land Use/Zoning township issues
Attachments: Zoning Commission_Land Use Handout 04122012.pdf
FAXED to Vic Grimm at number provided: 330-274-0146
Topics:
Land Use Committee
All Boards Meetings
Resignations and/or Hearing to Remove Zoning Commission Members
Trustees:
At the April 5 township trustee meeting a joint zoning commission meeting and Land Use Committee meeting was announced for 4/12 and an All Boards meeting for 4/26/2012.
During public comment portion of the meeting I requested the joint zoning commission with the Land Use Committee be cancelled as the Land Use Committee has not met since 2001 and for all intents and purposes is defunct, and as I cited Resolution 98-24 (Mantua Twp trustee minutes April 1998), the Land Use Committee is a township committee that comes under the trustees, not the zoning commission.
I also requested the scheduled All Boards meeting not be held. The All Boards meetings are something that came about this century; when held, are on the 5th Thursdays; and consists [sic] of The Board of Trustees, Board of Zoning Appeals, Zoning Commission and Zoning inspector. Technically, the zoning commission is not a board and neither is the zoning inspector. There should be no reason for these meetings.
My request to cancel these meetings was not addressed.
The combined Zoning Commission/Land Use Committee was held last night. Attached is the handout from that meeting. It is not the function of a defunct Land Use Committee to advise the Zoning Commission (who took ten plus years to rewrite the zoning resolution) how to plan for the future of Mantua Township. That function belongs to the residents of Mantua Township.
In the meeting held last night, the zoning commission exceeded the scope of their responsibility in several areas.
The All Boards meeting is being requested by the BZA to go over the new zoning resolution adopted December 2011. The more appropriate meeting would be a special township trustee meeting/workshop.
At this time, I am requesting the trustees:
1. Re-establish the Land Use Committee by advertising for people who are interested in serving on the
Land Use Committee or abolish it.
2. Change the All Boards meeting to a special trustee meeting to be held April 26.
3. Request the resignations of Zoning Commission members Lynn Harvey, Roger Hurd, Terri Vechery, Dave Pollard and Nick Ehlert. If they will not resign, the trustees hold the removal hearing.
I can be reached by email or telephone at 330-322-6035. Please let me know if you have questions and if resignations are not forthcoming what the process is for the removal hearing. Thank you.
[Blogger: I assume that the initials at the bottom of the letter are Dawn's.]
When Vic had finished reading the letter, Lynn Harvey, chair of the Zoning Commission, asked, "This letter is part of the public record now?"
Vic: Yes.
Lynn Harvey: I have a response to this or you can talk first.
Vic: The Zoning Commission is merely the one that calls the Land Use [Committee] to meet. Todd Peetz addressed this issue of "defunct"--some townships' [Land Use Committees] have not met for 15 or more years. As far as people still sitting on the board, there is still a quorum. I think we have addressed the All Boards meeting--we have always had one and have advertised it that way. As far as the resignations and removal hearing, that is in the new zoning book.
I don't know how the other trustees feel about it.
Jason: Whatever the situation with the Land Use plan, I am busy with the roads and cemetery. I appreciate that the Zoning Commission ran with that [Land Use]. I don't have time. I am constantly dealing with phone calls and other things.
As far as the resignations, Zoning Commission members are appointed by the trustees and have an obligation to serve their term. The trustees can call a hearing to remove, but according to the prosecutor, some kind of malfeasance or activity by which the person has been detrimental to the public [is necessary]. The trustees can not simply remove the member. The person has a right to have a hearing. A hired employee can be fired at w3ill.
The trustees can request resignations and people could go peacefully, but I don't think we are at a point where we should do that.
John Festa: No comments. Not really. There may be some merit in some of this, but I have not studied it enough to make an educated comment.
Lynn Harvey: Can I give my response to this?
Jason: Please be brief.
Lynn: Before I called the Land Use meeting, this had sort of come up and I called Chris Meduri before calling the meeting. I already had the go-ahead for the meeting. Chris Meduri said this: The Land Use Committee is called a Citizens Advisory Committee. It is not a statutory committee. It is not controlled by the Ohio Revised Code; it is not based on legal statute. That means we can do whatever we want with the Land Use Committee. Yes, it has been a long time since we have met, but I think we did not feel like calling them in and telling them that we were still doing the re-write.
The Zoning Commission controls this. It does not expire or become defunct.
This is all from Chris Meduri and he will put it in a letter if we are still being questioned here.
Regarding the All Boards meetings, the trustees call those. I would like to see them continue.
What is going on with the Zoning Commission is total harassment and Dawn Pechman has been doing this for at least 10 years. There is a file of all kinds of complaints [directed to and at the trustees and the township] which have no legal basis. Every one of these has been rebutted by our legal counsel. This is harassment. Why she does it you will have to ask her. The Zoning Commission is at some point perhaps going to give you [trustees] some advice during your term. What will it look like if there is a letter out there asking for the removal of 5/7 of the Zoning Commission? How are we going to function with this kind of divisiveness? I don't know what we can do to stop it. But this commission [Zoning] has never been taken to court or cited. The nature of zoning makes you unpopular because you sometimes have to say no to people. If that is what it's about, get used to it. These things go out into cyberspace and people believe it.
I want to be on record that this is harassment. I can have Chris Meduri write a letter about it.
Dawn: [Blogger: I have to get a recording of this, and it will NOT be from the private website. However, it is vintage Dawn and stuff that she has been saying ever since I began attending meetings in about 2004, so I will summarize until I can get a recording and insert those statements--I will not call them information--here.]
First, Dawn agreed with Lynn about divisiveness. [What she left out is that she herself has been a major source of it for years. But if anyone identifies her responsibility in any problem or situation, she goes into Whirlpool Corporation spin mode and picks up as little as a single word--as here--to piggy back onto and "agree" with the speaker.]
Next, Dawn launched into her standard refrain about all being one township and needing to communicate with each other, [and that is exactly the purpose of the All Boards meeting; does anyone else remember how, after 9/11, the most popular phrase was "connect the dots" which hadn't been done because various entities hadn't communicated with each other?]
Continuing, Dawn said that we have the right to see records and ask questions. She mentioned someone who in 1998 (!) was having trouble getting records. [She has requested and seen THOUSANDS of records and has asked the same questions time after time after time. The answers haven't changed because the facts haven't changed, despite Dawn's allegation in a meeting that facts change. Not that I've noticed, they don't. Gravity still works: do an arabesque out a tenth-floor window, and you go splat at the end of the flight. Eat junk food, and you get fat. Stiff your lawyer, and you lose the house.]
[Blogger: Chronologically, the next event in the meeting was a discussion of the website legal policy. I am going to give part of public comment here because it is directly related to what is posted above.]
Dave Pollard: First, I would like to thank the trustees [for] accepting my offer to salvage the demolished [cemetery] shed. If I had been able to get to the [last] meeting [in time] I would have given you $300 and counted it a bargain. Less than 2% of that wood in that building showed any weakness. I wish you would think things over more thoroughly the next time you dispose of township property that can be reused.
Dave, continuing: Five of us have been named for removal. Malfeasance was used, so our names have been linked with that.
Dave asked for the reason to be given--for the trustees to ask Dawn to give her reasons.
Jason wanted to have that done after the meeting.
Dave: No, Jason, this was brought out in public and we have a right to know in public. I think we have the right to know in public.
Jason to Dawn: Do you have a brief response?
Dawn: The last line is it. [Blogger: I just scrolled back up and looked. Nada.] Dawn continued: I have been trying to talk to people for a long time and this was my last action. [???]
[Blogger: Two things. First, the law states that we have the right to know who accuses us and also the right to know the charges. Dawn skated on this one. Again.
Second, why those five people? Answer: Each one of them has opposed Dawn or criticized Jason. Except for Nick Ehlert. Apparently his crime is that he read a letter supporting the use and restoration of the school. In addition to their opposition and criticism, each of those people has demonstrated leadership.]
Vic: We received a letter. Some names have been named here in this letter and I think we should address it.
The topics are the Land Use Committee, All Boards, and [a demand to] remove some Zoning members.
Blogger: The letter is given below.
From: Dawn Pechman [dawnpechman@windstream.net]
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2012 6:29 PM
To: 'Jason Carlton'; 'John Festa'
Subject: Land Use/Zoning township issues
Attachments: Zoning Commission_Land Use Handout 04122012.pdf
FAXED to Vic Grimm at number provided: 330-274-0146
Topics:
Land Use Committee
All Boards Meetings
Resignations and/or Hearing to Remove Zoning Commission Members
Trustees:
At the April 5 township trustee meeting a joint zoning commission meeting and Land Use Committee meeting was announced for 4/12 and an All Boards meeting for 4/26/2012.
During public comment portion of the meeting I requested the joint zoning commission with the Land Use Committee be cancelled as the Land Use Committee has not met since 2001 and for all intents and purposes is defunct, and as I cited Resolution 98-24 (Mantua Twp trustee minutes April 1998), the Land Use Committee is a township committee that comes under the trustees, not the zoning commission.
I also requested the scheduled All Boards meeting not be held. The All Boards meetings are something that came about this century; when held, are on the 5th Thursdays; and consists [sic] of The Board of Trustees, Board of Zoning Appeals, Zoning Commission and Zoning inspector. Technically, the zoning commission is not a board and neither is the zoning inspector. There should be no reason for these meetings.
My request to cancel these meetings was not addressed.
The combined Zoning Commission/Land Use Committee was held last night. Attached is the handout from that meeting. It is not the function of a defunct Land Use Committee to advise the Zoning Commission (who took ten plus years to rewrite the zoning resolution) how to plan for the future of Mantua Township. That function belongs to the residents of Mantua Township.
In the meeting held last night, the zoning commission exceeded the scope of their responsibility in several areas.
The All Boards meeting is being requested by the BZA to go over the new zoning resolution adopted December 2011. The more appropriate meeting would be a special township trustee meeting/workshop.
At this time, I am requesting the trustees:
1. Re-establish the Land Use Committee by advertising for people who are interested in serving on the
Land Use Committee or abolish it.
2. Change the All Boards meeting to a special trustee meeting to be held April 26.
3. Request the resignations of Zoning Commission members Lynn Harvey, Roger Hurd, Terri Vechery, Dave Pollard and Nick Ehlert. If they will not resign, the trustees hold the removal hearing.
I can be reached by email or telephone at 330-322-6035. Please let me know if you have questions and if resignations are not forthcoming what the process is for the removal hearing. Thank you.
[Blogger: I assume that the initials at the bottom of the letter are Dawn's.]
When Vic had finished reading the letter, Lynn Harvey, chair of the Zoning Commission, asked, "This letter is part of the public record now?"
Vic: Yes.
Lynn Harvey: I have a response to this or you can talk first.
Vic: The Zoning Commission is merely the one that calls the Land Use [Committee] to meet. Todd Peetz addressed this issue of "defunct"--some townships' [Land Use Committees] have not met for 15 or more years. As far as people still sitting on the board, there is still a quorum. I think we have addressed the All Boards meeting--we have always had one and have advertised it that way. As far as the resignations and removal hearing, that is in the new zoning book.
I don't know how the other trustees feel about it.
Jason: Whatever the situation with the Land Use plan, I am busy with the roads and cemetery. I appreciate that the Zoning Commission ran with that [Land Use]. I don't have time. I am constantly dealing with phone calls and other things.
As far as the resignations, Zoning Commission members are appointed by the trustees and have an obligation to serve their term. The trustees can call a hearing to remove, but according to the prosecutor, some kind of malfeasance or activity by which the person has been detrimental to the public [is necessary]. The trustees can not simply remove the member. The person has a right to have a hearing. A hired employee can be fired at w3ill.
The trustees can request resignations and people could go peacefully, but I don't think we are at a point where we should do that.
John Festa: No comments. Not really. There may be some merit in some of this, but I have not studied it enough to make an educated comment.
Lynn Harvey: Can I give my response to this?
Jason: Please be brief.
Lynn: Before I called the Land Use meeting, this had sort of come up and I called Chris Meduri before calling the meeting. I already had the go-ahead for the meeting. Chris Meduri said this: The Land Use Committee is called a Citizens Advisory Committee. It is not a statutory committee. It is not controlled by the Ohio Revised Code; it is not based on legal statute. That means we can do whatever we want with the Land Use Committee. Yes, it has been a long time since we have met, but I think we did not feel like calling them in and telling them that we were still doing the re-write.
The Zoning Commission controls this. It does not expire or become defunct.
This is all from Chris Meduri and he will put it in a letter if we are still being questioned here.
Regarding the All Boards meetings, the trustees call those. I would like to see them continue.
What is going on with the Zoning Commission is total harassment and Dawn Pechman has been doing this for at least 10 years. There is a file of all kinds of complaints [directed to and at the trustees and the township] which have no legal basis. Every one of these has been rebutted by our legal counsel. This is harassment. Why she does it you will have to ask her. The Zoning Commission is at some point perhaps going to give you [trustees] some advice during your term. What will it look like if there is a letter out there asking for the removal of 5/7 of the Zoning Commission? How are we going to function with this kind of divisiveness? I don't know what we can do to stop it. But this commission [Zoning] has never been taken to court or cited. The nature of zoning makes you unpopular because you sometimes have to say no to people. If that is what it's about, get used to it. These things go out into cyberspace and people believe it.
I want to be on record that this is harassment. I can have Chris Meduri write a letter about it.
Dawn: [Blogger: I have to get a recording of this, and it will NOT be from the private website. However, it is vintage Dawn and stuff that she has been saying ever since I began attending meetings in about 2004, so I will summarize until I can get a recording and insert those statements--I will not call them information--here.]
First, Dawn agreed with Lynn about divisiveness. [What she left out is that she herself has been a major source of it for years. But if anyone identifies her responsibility in any problem or situation, she goes into Whirlpool Corporation spin mode and picks up as little as a single word--as here--to piggy back onto and "agree" with the speaker.]
Next, Dawn launched into her standard refrain about all being one township and needing to communicate with each other, [and that is exactly the purpose of the All Boards meeting; does anyone else remember how, after 9/11, the most popular phrase was "connect the dots" which hadn't been done because various entities hadn't communicated with each other?]
Continuing, Dawn said that we have the right to see records and ask questions. She mentioned someone who in 1998 (!) was having trouble getting records. [She has requested and seen THOUSANDS of records and has asked the same questions time after time after time. The answers haven't changed because the facts haven't changed, despite Dawn's allegation in a meeting that facts change. Not that I've noticed, they don't. Gravity still works: do an arabesque out a tenth-floor window, and you go splat at the end of the flight. Eat junk food, and you get fat. Stiff your lawyer, and you lose the house.]
[Blogger: Chronologically, the next event in the meeting was a discussion of the website legal policy. I am going to give part of public comment here because it is directly related to what is posted above.]
Dave Pollard: First, I would like to thank the trustees [for] accepting my offer to salvage the demolished [cemetery] shed. If I had been able to get to the [last] meeting [in time] I would have given you $300 and counted it a bargain. Less than 2% of that wood in that building showed any weakness. I wish you would think things over more thoroughly the next time you dispose of township property that can be reused.
Dave, continuing: Five of us have been named for removal. Malfeasance was used, so our names have been linked with that.
Dave asked for the reason to be given--for the trustees to ask Dawn to give her reasons.
Jason wanted to have that done after the meeting.
Dave: No, Jason, this was brought out in public and we have a right to know in public. I think we have the right to know in public.
Jason to Dawn: Do you have a brief response?
Dawn: The last line is it. [Blogger: I just scrolled back up and looked. Nada.] Dawn continued: I have been trying to talk to people for a long time and this was my last action. [???]
[Blogger: Two things. First, the law states that we have the right to know who accuses us and also the right to know the charges. Dawn skated on this one. Again.
Second, why those five people? Answer: Each one of them has opposed Dawn or criticized Jason. Except for Nick Ehlert. Apparently his crime is that he read a letter supporting the use and restoration of the school. In addition to their opposition and criticism, each of those people has demonstrated leadership.]
Sunday, April 22, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees, April 19, 2012, Pt. 2: More on the School
Foreword: If you are like me (meaning that you grew up with books and writing went top to bottom), getting used to electronic format (earliest writing is at the bottom), then this introductory note is for you.
The posts for this meeting have to be read in order of posting to get their full significance.
Vic's remarks that follow are part of his Trustees report.
Vic: Referred to a school permit [a building permit].
Jason: We have an open electrical permit for the annex. Is that what you are talking about?
Vic: This is mostly about the basement.
Jason: Here are my thoughts on it. I have been hearing a lot from Marie Stehli and the Zoning Commission that they need space. We have a couple of options to address that. We can be creative on that.
Jason, continuing: The Historical Society meets upstairs. [It] moves out and Marie moves upstairs.
Jason, continuing: Another is to tear out the stage in the Civic Center and create offices.
Third, we use the Center School main floor for offices and use it as proposed in 2004. Up to now all the concentration has been on the annex and basement. So to answer your question I would propose that we forego any open permit for the basement and focus our efforts on getting space. Or we could rent space for these folks[elsewhere] in Mantua Township.
But obviously there is an immediate need that folks have. Obviously we don't have offices that are township related. The Trustees do their work in their business or personal space. I think we should forego the space in the basement and focus our efforts on getting people in.
Jason: There would be costs involved with accessibility and renovation. I think there is enough drive in the Township that if we decided, we could do it.
[Blogger: Most of this "creative thinking" absolutely baffles me. We had a tenant patiently waiting to move into the building--Debby Vogias' co-op pre-school. Marie commented once that if the pre-school had moved in three years ago (and I do not know why that time frame was chosen), we would have had $6,000 in income--and remember, dear readers, that one of the howls of complaint about the school has been "waste," and a second accusation was that there was no tenant in sight. I don't know why the pre-school was never mentioned in rebuttal to that accusation. But now, as "creative solutions," we consider evicting the Historical Society and putting Marie into an office with no access--have you seen the stairs to the Township Hall second floor?--or put offices into the Civic Center, which is regularly rented to the public. But the records must be secure, and that has been an issue with having them in a private home. What am I missing? Yes, the final option was to work to get into the school--but what in the world were those other three "options"?]
Vic: My understanding is that we can move into our building right now.
[Blogger: What has recently changed in all of this is that the building is within shouting distance of being placed on the National Register of Historic Places (it is already part of the Township's Historic District, if you have ever read the historic marker outside of the Township Hall). Buildings with historic status are not as rigidly bound by current code requirements as new construction.]
Jason: If that is the case, then if we are able to move into the first [main] floor right now, then what do we do about older people and people who are not mobile and have issues getting up stairs?
Vic: For right now they would use the annex area and we would meet them down there. It is my understanding from Randy Roberts [Head of Portage County Building Department] that it is our building and we can move into it and use it.
John Festa: I have concerns about going down another blind alley. I want a plan in hand and [want to] know what it is going to cost us. I propose that we should get the community involved to see about requirements for records and meeting space. Do this in a public meeting. [Blogger: Isn't that what we have twice a month? They're called Trustees meetings.]
Vic: The building is there for use. A lot of it is going to be [just] a lot of cleaning.
Jason: I would like to get the requirements from [the] All Boards and what we want, end stage. Then we come up with a cost estimate to get from Point A to Point B.
Lynn, you are here representing the Zoning Commission. If you can come up with a list of requirements-- He asked for the same from Marie.
Vic: All of the rooms on that first floor are very large.
Lynn: Is it possible that we could go in there and look at it?
Vic: Yes--I can meet with you.
John Festa: It is a noble idea, but I need more facts.
Sandy Engelhart: We have an All Boards meeting coming up soon. Can we have this discussion at that time?
Jason: The advertisement has gone out for Zoning matters only. [Two notes here: First, Sandy, in case you don't have all of this tattooed on the inside of your arm, or something, is an alternate on the Board of Zoning Appeals, and she is absolutely faithful in her focus on zoning matters. Second, the All Boards meeting is considered a special meeting, and a special meeting can either be for only one purpose or can only be for the advertised purpose. (And I wish I had that restriction firmly in mind. No matter.) That's the reason for Jason's comment.]
Sandy: But we can set another time for an All Boards meeting to discuss this.
Answer: Yes.
Jason: Neither I nor the other Trustees are project managers.
Vic: Then we will pursue this and try to get a meeting set up.
Jason: We can talk about it but it needs special attention.
[Blogger: Remember that Jason stated in the League of Women Voters candidates tabloid in 2009 that he would work to get us into the old Center School. Since then, he has twice said that he would sell the school if the price were right, and I have been in meetings when he sought to deflect money from the school. In one meeting, even though the money had already been appropriated, he said he had a hard time with signing something to OK spending it. Mark was absent from that meeting, so Jason had to make a decision. He told Vic that if Vic made the motion, he, Jason would sign it.
So--what kind of special attention is this situation going to get now?]
Blogger: That's enough for now. Some other things were said about the school during Public Comment, but Part 1 and Part 2 contain some quite interesting--I am trying really hard to be bland and neutral here--and significant statements by the Trustees. Our comments may or may not have some effect on them. The real purpose of this blog is to make sure that you know what our elected officials are about. Well, at least, what they are about in the official meetings. "Old timers" are of the opinion that with January 1, 2012, we had gone back almost 30 years to a time when the real meetings didn't happen in the Township Hall.
The posts for this meeting have to be read in order of posting to get their full significance.
Vic's remarks that follow are part of his Trustees report.
Vic: Referred to a school permit [a building permit].
Jason: We have an open electrical permit for the annex. Is that what you are talking about?
Vic: This is mostly about the basement.
Jason: Here are my thoughts on it. I have been hearing a lot from Marie Stehli and the Zoning Commission that they need space. We have a couple of options to address that. We can be creative on that.
Jason, continuing: The Historical Society meets upstairs. [It] moves out and Marie moves upstairs.
Jason, continuing: Another is to tear out the stage in the Civic Center and create offices.
Third, we use the Center School main floor for offices and use it as proposed in 2004. Up to now all the concentration has been on the annex and basement. So to answer your question I would propose that we forego any open permit for the basement and focus our efforts on getting space. Or we could rent space for these folks[elsewhere] in Mantua Township.
But obviously there is an immediate need that folks have. Obviously we don't have offices that are township related. The Trustees do their work in their business or personal space. I think we should forego the space in the basement and focus our efforts on getting people in.
Jason: There would be costs involved with accessibility and renovation. I think there is enough drive in the Township that if we decided, we could do it.
[Blogger: Most of this "creative thinking" absolutely baffles me. We had a tenant patiently waiting to move into the building--Debby Vogias' co-op pre-school. Marie commented once that if the pre-school had moved in three years ago (and I do not know why that time frame was chosen), we would have had $6,000 in income--and remember, dear readers, that one of the howls of complaint about the school has been "waste," and a second accusation was that there was no tenant in sight. I don't know why the pre-school was never mentioned in rebuttal to that accusation. But now, as "creative solutions," we consider evicting the Historical Society and putting Marie into an office with no access--have you seen the stairs to the Township Hall second floor?--or put offices into the Civic Center, which is regularly rented to the public. But the records must be secure, and that has been an issue with having them in a private home. What am I missing? Yes, the final option was to work to get into the school--but what in the world were those other three "options"?]
Vic: My understanding is that we can move into our building right now.
[Blogger: What has recently changed in all of this is that the building is within shouting distance of being placed on the National Register of Historic Places (it is already part of the Township's Historic District, if you have ever read the historic marker outside of the Township Hall). Buildings with historic status are not as rigidly bound by current code requirements as new construction.]
Jason: If that is the case, then if we are able to move into the first [main] floor right now, then what do we do about older people and people who are not mobile and have issues getting up stairs?
Vic: For right now they would use the annex area and we would meet them down there. It is my understanding from Randy Roberts [Head of Portage County Building Department] that it is our building and we can move into it and use it.
John Festa: I have concerns about going down another blind alley. I want a plan in hand and [want to] know what it is going to cost us. I propose that we should get the community involved to see about requirements for records and meeting space. Do this in a public meeting. [Blogger: Isn't that what we have twice a month? They're called Trustees meetings.]
Vic: The building is there for use. A lot of it is going to be [just] a lot of cleaning.
Jason: I would like to get the requirements from [the] All Boards and what we want, end stage. Then we come up with a cost estimate to get from Point A to Point B.
Lynn, you are here representing the Zoning Commission. If you can come up with a list of requirements-- He asked for the same from Marie.
Vic: All of the rooms on that first floor are very large.
Lynn: Is it possible that we could go in there and look at it?
Vic: Yes--I can meet with you.
John Festa: It is a noble idea, but I need more facts.
Sandy Engelhart: We have an All Boards meeting coming up soon. Can we have this discussion at that time?
Jason: The advertisement has gone out for Zoning matters only. [Two notes here: First, Sandy, in case you don't have all of this tattooed on the inside of your arm, or something, is an alternate on the Board of Zoning Appeals, and she is absolutely faithful in her focus on zoning matters. Second, the All Boards meeting is considered a special meeting, and a special meeting can either be for only one purpose or can only be for the advertised purpose. (And I wish I had that restriction firmly in mind. No matter.) That's the reason for Jason's comment.]
Sandy: But we can set another time for an All Boards meeting to discuss this.
Answer: Yes.
Jason: Neither I nor the other Trustees are project managers.
Vic: Then we will pursue this and try to get a meeting set up.
Jason: We can talk about it but it needs special attention.
[Blogger: Remember that Jason stated in the League of Women Voters candidates tabloid in 2009 that he would work to get us into the old Center School. Since then, he has twice said that he would sell the school if the price were right, and I have been in meetings when he sought to deflect money from the school. In one meeting, even though the money had already been appropriated, he said he had a hard time with signing something to OK spending it. Mark was absent from that meeting, so Jason had to make a decision. He told Vic that if Vic made the motion, he, Jason would sign it.
So--what kind of special attention is this situation going to get now?]
Blogger: That's enough for now. Some other things were said about the school during Public Comment, but Part 1 and Part 2 contain some quite interesting--I am trying really hard to be bland and neutral here--and significant statements by the Trustees. Our comments may or may not have some effect on them. The real purpose of this blog is to make sure that you know what our elected officials are about. Well, at least, what they are about in the official meetings. "Old timers" are of the opinion that with January 1, 2012, we had gone back almost 30 years to a time when the real meetings didn't happen in the Township Hall.
Mantua Township Trustees 4-19-12, Pt. 1
Foreword: Since the blog is not a transcript (I am not a court/conference reporter with a nifty little machine) and since my goal is to put the pieces together, this is the second set of posts juxtaposing Trustees' commentary and business with related Public Comment. The official record of any meeting is in the minutes, available on request from the Township Fiscal Officer. The Township is moving towards an official .gov website, but at present, despite appearances, there is NO official Mantua Township website.
The meeting began with a presentation from the OTCO representative, Cecil, showing the GIS mapping of various features of the township: culverts, road signs, catch basins, and the Township's one manhole. Since an intern was used for much of the work, the cost was minimal, compared with what an engineering firm would have charged. The benefit of having this done is that it should save the road department time in locating where work may have to be done; the computer map can be accessed to determine locations of items.
After some questions and answers, Jason recessed the meeting for long enough for Cecil to pack the equipment and take his leave. The meeting resumed at 8:07.
Marie gave the financial report and correspondence regarding Round 27, grant applications for paving.
Marie also gave the Trustees a letter requesting a change in venue and read the letter into the public record. Its complete text follows.
April 19, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees
Jason Carlton
John Festa
Victor Grimm
Dear Trustees,
For several years I have worked out of my house, providing space, electricity, and security for Mantua Township records. The space used has been housed in my personal business office, and is taking up increasingly more space. I am also concerned because the copier and several boxes of records are stored within 1-2 fee of a space heater. There is no more space in this office for these records.
Because I need to make repairs in my office, and because my own space needs are becoming increasingly more difficult to fill, I am requesting that the township provide me office space in the Mantua Center School. This building was purchased years ago to serve the township as an administration building, and I would like to see this happen, beginning with moving my office to that facility.
I would like to have this move completed before July 1, 2012.
Marie Stehli
Fiscal Officer
With neither acknowledgment nor comment, Jason announced that, also as part of the correspondence, they had the annual bridge report.
Next was discussion about finances--the cemetery operating supplies were getting tight, and Jason wanted to move $1,000 from operating costs into the cemetery [fund].
Vic asked what fund the money could come out of. Answer: Contracted services.
Marie said that because the rubber mats to protect the cemetery lawn during grave digging had come out of the operating supplies, that account/fund was now down to $193. [Note: Approximately $2500 had been approved by the trustees for those mats.] Marie continued, saying that most of what had been used out of that fund was for lawn care. The motion to move the money was made, seconded, and passed.
Zoning came next. Lynn Harvey, Chairperson of the Zoning Commission, reported that the Zoning Commission and the Land Use Committee had met the previous week (April 12) for an update on what had been done with the re-write of the zoning book. It will be a while before we get back with everyone.
Lynn: Are we still having an All Boards meeting? [Blogger: The reason for this question will become clear later in this group of posts.]
Marie: I have letters in the car and will give them to people who are here and then mail them.
Note: That meeting is scheduled for Thursday, April 26, at 7 p.m. in the Township Hall.
Lynn, continuing: Since the office space issue came up, if that works for Marie, could we do the same thing for Zoning? We have been promised that. Maybe the computer and files could be there. We would like to get in on that deal if that could be accomplished as well.
Jason (I believe--blogger): Anything else?
Vic: There was a letter we received about the All Boards meeting and the Land Use Committee.
To the other trustees: Do you want to discuss that at this time?
Jason: It's up to you. We all received the same e-mail. I did not have it as a discussion topic, but if you want to discuss it we can.
Vic: Sorted through his packet and then said, I will have to locate it. Maybe we will discuss it under new business.
The meeting began with a presentation from the OTCO representative, Cecil, showing the GIS mapping of various features of the township: culverts, road signs, catch basins, and the Township's one manhole. Since an intern was used for much of the work, the cost was minimal, compared with what an engineering firm would have charged. The benefit of having this done is that it should save the road department time in locating where work may have to be done; the computer map can be accessed to determine locations of items.
After some questions and answers, Jason recessed the meeting for long enough for Cecil to pack the equipment and take his leave. The meeting resumed at 8:07.
Marie gave the financial report and correspondence regarding Round 27, grant applications for paving.
Marie also gave the Trustees a letter requesting a change in venue and read the letter into the public record. Its complete text follows.
April 19, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees
Jason Carlton
John Festa
Victor Grimm
Dear Trustees,
For several years I have worked out of my house, providing space, electricity, and security for Mantua Township records. The space used has been housed in my personal business office, and is taking up increasingly more space. I am also concerned because the copier and several boxes of records are stored within 1-2 fee of a space heater. There is no more space in this office for these records.
Because I need to make repairs in my office, and because my own space needs are becoming increasingly more difficult to fill, I am requesting that the township provide me office space in the Mantua Center School. This building was purchased years ago to serve the township as an administration building, and I would like to see this happen, beginning with moving my office to that facility.
I would like to have this move completed before July 1, 2012.
Marie Stehli
Fiscal Officer
With neither acknowledgment nor comment, Jason announced that, also as part of the correspondence, they had the annual bridge report.
Next was discussion about finances--the cemetery operating supplies were getting tight, and Jason wanted to move $1,000 from operating costs into the cemetery [fund].
Vic asked what fund the money could come out of. Answer: Contracted services.
Marie said that because the rubber mats to protect the cemetery lawn during grave digging had come out of the operating supplies, that account/fund was now down to $193. [Note: Approximately $2500 had been approved by the trustees for those mats.] Marie continued, saying that most of what had been used out of that fund was for lawn care. The motion to move the money was made, seconded, and passed.
Zoning came next. Lynn Harvey, Chairperson of the Zoning Commission, reported that the Zoning Commission and the Land Use Committee had met the previous week (April 12) for an update on what had been done with the re-write of the zoning book. It will be a while before we get back with everyone.
Lynn: Are we still having an All Boards meeting? [Blogger: The reason for this question will become clear later in this group of posts.]
Marie: I have letters in the car and will give them to people who are here and then mail them.
Note: That meeting is scheduled for Thursday, April 26, at 7 p.m. in the Township Hall.
Lynn, continuing: Since the office space issue came up, if that works for Marie, could we do the same thing for Zoning? We have been promised that. Maybe the computer and files could be there. We would like to get in on that deal if that could be accomplished as well.
Jason (I believe--blogger): Anything else?
Vic: There was a letter we received about the All Boards meeting and the Land Use Committee.
To the other trustees: Do you want to discuss that at this time?
Jason: It's up to you. We all received the same e-mail. I did not have it as a discussion topic, but if you want to discuss it we can.
Vic: Sorted through his packet and then said, I will have to locate it. Maybe we will discuss it under new business.
Thursday, April 19, 2012
Historical Limerick 4-19-12
"I did not come here for a fight,
But if they mean
To have war
Let it begin here!"
Capt. Josiah Parker, Lexington Green, April 19, 1775
But if they mean
To have war
Let it begin here!"
Capt. Josiah Parker, Lexington Green, April 19, 1775
Saturday, April 14, 2012
Combined Zoning Commission-Land Use Committee Mtg., April 12, 2012 (2)
Part Two
Historic Preservation was a part of the meeting, and I have decided to give it its own post, first because I have tried to keep posts short enough to encourage people to read them.
Lynn Harvey stated the second reason for posting this separately. Here are my notes on her comments and those of the members of the Zoning Commission and the Land Use Committee on that topic.
Lynn: We are meeting in the historic district of the Township. There have been some sentiments that the old school has been a waste of time and money and should not be finished, but demolished. My personal feelling is that the building is a wonderful part of the community and should be finished.
Other than scattered century homes and farm outbuildings, this is the greatest concentration of historic buildings. It would be inappropriate to put an all glass and steel home across from the Township buildings, for example.
We learned from the Historical Society that 30-35 years ago the buildings on the green were placed on the National Register of Historic Places. When you travel to communities where the old buildings have been retained, they are pretty places, not homogenized. Those buildings are in reasonably good shape.
Why can't we do the same thing with the school? It needs things to be done with it to make it usable. We [the Township] are in the black. What would be the point of spending lots of money to replace it?
Cal Brant: A lot of people are interested in space in this building. To see us waste something already in place . . . . [Blogger: Cal trailed off here, but the direction of the statement is clear.]
Lynn: The Trustees bought the building for meetings, assembly, and office space. The Zoning Commission thought of having room in the school for its offices. I was in three places trying to get everything together and done for this meeting--it takes an enormous amount of paper. Everything seeps to have been suspended and there is a group antagonistic to it.
There is no place else in the community where you could do this unless you go to a new place and spend millions of dollars. [Blogger: One such place is Deerfield Township, which spent $1,000,000 on its administrative offices and township hall. It is away from the center of the township.]
Cal Brant: Some money is beginning to come back into grant funds. I am sure we could come up with the grant money we need to move forward with this building here. But if we do not get the trustees off their duffs then nothing will happen. I said two years ago I would help with the bell tower.
Joan Martin: I was in hopes that we could get the offices here and get the files in one place.
Lynn: There are zoning files stored all over the place.
There was a question, perhaps from Joan, about the condition of the building.
Terri Vechery: It is exactly like it was when we went to school here.
Joy Brunetti: We are Township people--why can't we use this building?
Mark Hall: As a global view of the historic district, there are some things that can be addressed. he Land Use plan has to take a look at this as a historic area. It helps with a sense of community that you don't see any more.
Charlie English: The coming boom in prosperity from oil and gas should make a lot people wealthy, and my experience is that such people are generous. They might make donations or bequests to the school for its maintenance. One possibility is to sell business office condos. [ Blogger: I was told that this would actually be an R-2 use, while at present the zoning is for government use.] Charlie continued: The oil and gas development could be a boon for the community as long as it is not our undoing environmentally.
The following sections of the Zoning Book deal with Historic Preservation:
p. 9C: Historic and Cultural Features: Mantua Center School (1914)
p. 24 F. 1. Mantua Center is the primary historic area in the Twp.
p. 26: Statement of Objectives
G. Preserve historic integrity of areas in the township that contribute[s] significantly to the history of the township with such preservation efforts focused on Mantua Center.
p. 40 E. Historic Preservation.
1. Encourage Mantua Center as the "historic core of the township."
a) Develop standards to maintain the historic integrity and character of Mantua Center.
b) Preservation and adaptive reuse of existing historic structures.
c) Encourage public uses and community organizations to maximize use of structures in the area and
explore adaptive reuse options for . . . Mantua Center School.
d) Permit limited non-residential uses within significant historic homes if they are not marketable for single-family purposes as a way to minimize them from being torn down.
Historic Preservation was a part of the meeting, and I have decided to give it its own post, first because I have tried to keep posts short enough to encourage people to read them.
Lynn Harvey stated the second reason for posting this separately. Here are my notes on her comments and those of the members of the Zoning Commission and the Land Use Committee on that topic.
Lynn: We are meeting in the historic district of the Township. There have been some sentiments that the old school has been a waste of time and money and should not be finished, but demolished. My personal feelling is that the building is a wonderful part of the community and should be finished.
Other than scattered century homes and farm outbuildings, this is the greatest concentration of historic buildings. It would be inappropriate to put an all glass and steel home across from the Township buildings, for example.
We learned from the Historical Society that 30-35 years ago the buildings on the green were placed on the National Register of Historic Places. When you travel to communities where the old buildings have been retained, they are pretty places, not homogenized. Those buildings are in reasonably good shape.
Why can't we do the same thing with the school? It needs things to be done with it to make it usable. We [the Township] are in the black. What would be the point of spending lots of money to replace it?
Cal Brant: A lot of people are interested in space in this building. To see us waste something already in place . . . . [Blogger: Cal trailed off here, but the direction of the statement is clear.]
Lynn: The Trustees bought the building for meetings, assembly, and office space. The Zoning Commission thought of having room in the school for its offices. I was in three places trying to get everything together and done for this meeting--it takes an enormous amount of paper. Everything seeps to have been suspended and there is a group antagonistic to it.
There is no place else in the community where you could do this unless you go to a new place and spend millions of dollars. [Blogger: One such place is Deerfield Township, which spent $1,000,000 on its administrative offices and township hall. It is away from the center of the township.]
Cal Brant: Some money is beginning to come back into grant funds. I am sure we could come up with the grant money we need to move forward with this building here. But if we do not get the trustees off their duffs then nothing will happen. I said two years ago I would help with the bell tower.
Joan Martin: I was in hopes that we could get the offices here and get the files in one place.
Lynn: There are zoning files stored all over the place.
There was a question, perhaps from Joan, about the condition of the building.
Terri Vechery: It is exactly like it was when we went to school here.
Joy Brunetti: We are Township people--why can't we use this building?
Mark Hall: As a global view of the historic district, there are some things that can be addressed. he Land Use plan has to take a look at this as a historic area. It helps with a sense of community that you don't see any more.
Charlie English: The coming boom in prosperity from oil and gas should make a lot people wealthy, and my experience is that such people are generous. They might make donations or bequests to the school for its maintenance. One possibility is to sell business office condos. [ Blogger: I was told that this would actually be an R-2 use, while at present the zoning is for government use.] Charlie continued: The oil and gas development could be a boon for the community as long as it is not our undoing environmentally.
The following sections of the Zoning Book deal with Historic Preservation:
p. 9C: Historic and Cultural Features: Mantua Center School (1914)
p. 24 F. 1. Mantua Center is the primary historic area in the Twp.
p. 26: Statement of Objectives
G. Preserve historic integrity of areas in the township that contribute[s] significantly to the history of the township with such preservation efforts focused on Mantua Center.
p. 40 E. Historic Preservation.
1. Encourage Mantua Center as the "historic core of the township."
a) Develop standards to maintain the historic integrity and character of Mantua Center.
b) Preservation and adaptive reuse of existing historic structures.
c) Encourage public uses and community organizations to maximize use of structures in the area and
explore adaptive reuse options for . . . Mantua Center School.
d) Permit limited non-residential uses within significant historic homes if they are not marketable for single-family purposes as a way to minimize them from being torn down.
Combined Zoning Commission-Land Use Committee Mg., April 12, 2012
Part One
The purpose of the meeting was to update the Land Use Committee on the updated Zoning book, which is now legal and in play, as Lynn Harvey, Chairperson of the Zoning Commission, informed everyone.
She reviewed the amendments to the zoning book, which fell under three categories: text amendments, map amendments, and administrative revisions.
When the Zoning Commission got back what everyone thought was the final version several years ago and reviewed it, they discovered that it was full of all kinds of inaccuracies of both text and layout. There was nothing to do but go through it word by word. It took a while, and the Zoning Commission was regularly criticized both for taking so long and then for laying the responsibility where it belonged, with the previous staffing in the Regional Planning Office. (The Commission has said clearly and repeatedly that the new staff has been a pleasure to work with and the results are satisfying.)
Lynn commented that no map amendments had been made, since those always engendered enormous heat and controversy [and for "controversy," read "time."] Getting the rewrite done had taken a lot longer than anyone had anticipated, and trying to do map amendments on top of the text rewrite would have extended the time beyond reason.
The following new features were added to the Zoning Book:
Conditionally Permitted Home-Based Businesses; Agricultural Tourism; Home-Based Businesses by Certificate; Small Solar and Wind Energy Systems; Updates to Off-Street Parking and Loading and Signs.
Three topics engaged most of the discussion: the possible future uses of Jellystone Park; fracking; and Historic Preservation.
Charlie English, Land Use Committee member, was a fountain of information about the politics of fracking. The short form is that fracking operates on a cynical version of the Golden Rule: He who has the gold makes the rules, and the energy companies have LOTS of "gold" which they have spread around. One of the interesting things was that the money paid per acre to people who had signed up was perhaps as high as $1600, but that when the energy companies then sell those contracts--which they are doing--they get as much as $10,000 per acre.
Charlie also repeated what has been said and published before: Get legal advice before signing anything, and get your well checked now so that there is a baseline. He also alluded to the fact that the drilling companies will check the water, but that raises the issue of whether you want the fox guarding your henhouse.
The purpose of the meeting was to update the Land Use Committee on the updated Zoning book, which is now legal and in play, as Lynn Harvey, Chairperson of the Zoning Commission, informed everyone.
She reviewed the amendments to the zoning book, which fell under three categories: text amendments, map amendments, and administrative revisions.
When the Zoning Commission got back what everyone thought was the final version several years ago and reviewed it, they discovered that it was full of all kinds of inaccuracies of both text and layout. There was nothing to do but go through it word by word. It took a while, and the Zoning Commission was regularly criticized both for taking so long and then for laying the responsibility where it belonged, with the previous staffing in the Regional Planning Office. (The Commission has said clearly and repeatedly that the new staff has been a pleasure to work with and the results are satisfying.)
Lynn commented that no map amendments had been made, since those always engendered enormous heat and controversy [and for "controversy," read "time."] Getting the rewrite done had taken a lot longer than anyone had anticipated, and trying to do map amendments on top of the text rewrite would have extended the time beyond reason.
The following new features were added to the Zoning Book:
Conditionally Permitted Home-Based Businesses; Agricultural Tourism; Home-Based Businesses by Certificate; Small Solar and Wind Energy Systems; Updates to Off-Street Parking and Loading and Signs.
Three topics engaged most of the discussion: the possible future uses of Jellystone Park; fracking; and Historic Preservation.
Charlie English, Land Use Committee member, was a fountain of information about the politics of fracking. The short form is that fracking operates on a cynical version of the Golden Rule: He who has the gold makes the rules, and the energy companies have LOTS of "gold" which they have spread around. One of the interesting things was that the money paid per acre to people who had signed up was perhaps as high as $1600, but that when the energy companies then sell those contracts--which they are doing--they get as much as $10,000 per acre.
Charlie also repeated what has been said and published before: Get legal advice before signing anything, and get your well checked now so that there is a baseline. He also alluded to the fact that the drilling companies will check the water, but that raises the issue of whether you want the fox guarding your henhouse.
Wednesday, April 11, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees Meeting April 5, 2012: last segment, old business
Under other Old Business, Vic presented a check for $23.00 and a receipt for $2.00 cash, both for salvage of material from the shed in the cemetery that was ordered to be torn down at the last meeting. Dave Pollard had made the offer in order to go through the pile and salvage what he could.
Jason: Can we talk about that later?
John Festa: Where are we with the trailers? [These are the trailers on the west side of the school building where Debby Vogias has been storing the equipment for the daycare co-op that she had hoped to have in the building.]
There was discussion about putting the trailers up for sale on an on-line auction site--how to advertise, how to accommodate people who do not have computers. The perceived value is under $2500.
John Festa asked about the south trailer, saying that now we have a mess on the outside--I went by the other day. I asked Chris Meduri to take action on it. I want to make a motion for the occupants of the trailer to vacate within 30 days so we can sell the trailer.
Vic: When are we going to put the first one on?
Jason: I have not been able to get hold of them. {Blogger: I do not know who "them" means here.]
Vic: Because I have to get some of our stuff out. The question about this trailer is that we were going to try to find space for the white cabinets.
John Festa: That was in the past. It is in Chris Meduri's hands now and I want to withdraw that offer.
Jason: I want to ask Chris Meduri to handle this. I want to have Chris Meduri's name on it.
[Of course they do. This whole affair has been awkward in the extreme. Despite all of the accusations that the Township did not have a tenant for the school, they did. It was Debby Vogias' co-op preschool. But instead of helping get her in there, she has been evicted. And what lawyers do is protect people from the consequences of their decisions.)
John Festa: So you want a motion for the occupant to vacate the trailer and to have Chris Meduri to handle the legal aspect. So moved; Jason, seconded. John Festa, yes; Jason Carlton, yes; Victor Grimm, abstained.
That was the end of the business meeting except for the executive session after public comment.
Jason: Can we talk about that later?
John Festa: Where are we with the trailers? [These are the trailers on the west side of the school building where Debby Vogias has been storing the equipment for the daycare co-op that she had hoped to have in the building.]
There was discussion about putting the trailers up for sale on an on-line auction site--how to advertise, how to accommodate people who do not have computers. The perceived value is under $2500.
John Festa asked about the south trailer, saying that now we have a mess on the outside--I went by the other day. I asked Chris Meduri to take action on it. I want to make a motion for the occupants of the trailer to vacate within 30 days so we can sell the trailer.
Vic: When are we going to put the first one on?
Jason: I have not been able to get hold of them. {Blogger: I do not know who "them" means here.]
Vic: Because I have to get some of our stuff out. The question about this trailer is that we were going to try to find space for the white cabinets.
John Festa: That was in the past. It is in Chris Meduri's hands now and I want to withdraw that offer.
Jason: I want to ask Chris Meduri to handle this. I want to have Chris Meduri's name on it.
[Of course they do. This whole affair has been awkward in the extreme. Despite all of the accusations that the Township did not have a tenant for the school, they did. It was Debby Vogias' co-op preschool. But instead of helping get her in there, she has been evicted. And what lawyers do is protect people from the consequences of their decisions.)
John Festa: So you want a motion for the occupant to vacate the trailer and to have Chris Meduri to handle the legal aspect. So moved; Jason, seconded. John Festa, yes; Jason Carlton, yes; Victor Grimm, abstained.
That was the end of the business meeting except for the executive session after public comment.
Mantua Township Trustees Meeting, April 5, 2012: Old Business (Website)
Old Business began at 8:45 with discussion about various policies regarding the website.
Jason (to Vic): I know you had questions about it last time. Have you had a final review on it?
Vic: Did Chris Meduri mention anything to you about wrapping it all into one--the contract and the legal policy?
Jason: There were a design agreement and a maintenance agreement.
Vic: Chris Meduri thinks he can wrap it all into one contract. Did he fax or e-mail anything to you?
John Festa did not see how terms of use fit into design.
Vic: This is just what he said this evening about 4:45. He thought we needed to review it, get it together, and then we can finish everything up.
Jason: He sent John and I [sic] an e-mail and then faxed it to you.
Vic: There is some stuff in it that Chris Meduri really needs to go back over. He wanted us to look at it to see if there is anything that we need to do.
John Festa: John wants to move forward on it. {Blogger: He did not seem pleased with Chris Meduri's recommendations. Does his desire to move forward have anything to do with the half-page, full color ad in the Community Journal with the private website trumpeting that the Township is going to have its own site "soon"? And now things will not occur for another two weeks.]
Vic: I would like to review this--I just got it at quarter to 5. Chris Meduri wants us to review it and get it back to him. [Blogger's emphasis.]
Jason: I am with you, John, I want to move forward with this absolutely by t he next meeting.
John Festa: What about some of these blanks? [This had to do with Brent Simon's compensation.]
Jason: Next meeting we can sign this if everything looks to good to you, Brent.
Vic: Once you get the information in the blanks, will you e-mail it down to Chris Meduri?
[Note: If I understand some of this correctly, the original document was--my words and understanding, here--a kind of boilerplate from the provider. What was under discussion at this meeting was something from Chris Meduri that was, I believe, better suited to the Township. I believe that Chris's goal is for us to have a website document tailored to us, not a one-size-fits-all approach. My own take on that one size is that it really means "You will all [be] fit[ted to] one size."]
[Blogger's aside, here: I know that things in the Township can and sometimes do move slowly, which was one of the loudest strings on Larry Lietzow's fiddle for at least two years, before John Festa was elected (note the restraint of that statement). Since then, there has been a fine display of promptitude, and a frequent remark of John Festa's is that he wants "to move forward" on whatever is at hand. That's background.
[Here's the aside: A number of years ago, the book that was all the rage was Stephen Covey's The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People. He made this comment: "Management is doing things right; leadership is doing the right things." Then he gave this example, which I love: Imagine a group of producers cutting their way through the jungle with machetes. They are clearing out the underbrush. The managers are following, writing policies and procedures, conducting training programs, doing all the things that managers do to make sure that everything is efficient. The leader climbs the tallest tree, checks everything out, and then yells, "Wrong jungle!" And what do those bustling producers and efficient managers say? "Shut up! We're making progress!"
[If the goal is to be effective, then efficiency may "suffer." But if the goal is just to crow about progress, then damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead, and who cares about those ship lights ahead as we plow onward? But what if those lights are actually on a lighthouse, and the present course is going to put the boat aground on it?]
The next item was on the ditch closures, proper sizes of piping in the ditches and for driveway culverts, rules and regulations for that, and a fee/permit schedule. Jason pointed out that we are the only township that pays for this kind of work; the others pass that cost to the resident/owner. The best thing is not for all of this to be perhaps not accurately presented in the blog, but for residents who need such work to get the proper information from those properly responsible for it.
Jason thought that it should be possible to pass a resolution on this at tonight's meeting.
Vic asked about people grandfathered in--those who had asked for such work and were waiting for it to be done. It amounted to 14-15 people.
John Festa thought it [I am not sure what the "it" refers to] looked OK.
Jason read the resolution, which is quite detailed. Anyone who wants to understand it should get it from the minutes. He also made the motion to adopt it; John Festa seconded, and it passed.
Jason made a motion that people who have previously requested culverts be exempted from the permit requirement. Vic seconded; passed.
Then there was discussion about the fee schedule. Vic commented that he did not think John Vechery had seen that yet.
There was discussion about how a fee schedule had rather high charges for quite small buildings. Vic made a motion, which was seconded and passed. It is Resolution #85. Check the official minutes.
Jason (to Vic): I know you had questions about it last time. Have you had a final review on it?
Vic: Did Chris Meduri mention anything to you about wrapping it all into one--the contract and the legal policy?
Jason: There were a design agreement and a maintenance agreement.
Vic: Chris Meduri thinks he can wrap it all into one contract. Did he fax or e-mail anything to you?
John Festa did not see how terms of use fit into design.
Vic: This is just what he said this evening about 4:45. He thought we needed to review it, get it together, and then we can finish everything up.
Jason: He sent John and I [sic] an e-mail and then faxed it to you.
Vic: There is some stuff in it that Chris Meduri really needs to go back over. He wanted us to look at it to see if there is anything that we need to do.
John Festa: John wants to move forward on it. {Blogger: He did not seem pleased with Chris Meduri's recommendations. Does his desire to move forward have anything to do with the half-page, full color ad in the Community Journal with the private website trumpeting that the Township is going to have its own site "soon"? And now things will not occur for another two weeks.]
Vic: I would like to review this--I just got it at quarter to 5. Chris Meduri wants us to review it and get it back to him. [Blogger's emphasis.]
Jason: I am with you, John, I want to move forward with this absolutely by t he next meeting.
John Festa: What about some of these blanks? [This had to do with Brent Simon's compensation.]
Jason: Next meeting we can sign this if everything looks to good to you, Brent.
Vic: Once you get the information in the blanks, will you e-mail it down to Chris Meduri?
[Note: If I understand some of this correctly, the original document was--my words and understanding, here--a kind of boilerplate from the provider. What was under discussion at this meeting was something from Chris Meduri that was, I believe, better suited to the Township. I believe that Chris's goal is for us to have a website document tailored to us, not a one-size-fits-all approach. My own take on that one size is that it really means "You will all [be] fit[ted to] one size."]
[Blogger's aside, here: I know that things in the Township can and sometimes do move slowly, which was one of the loudest strings on Larry Lietzow's fiddle for at least two years, before John Festa was elected (note the restraint of that statement). Since then, there has been a fine display of promptitude, and a frequent remark of John Festa's is that he wants "to move forward" on whatever is at hand. That's background.
[Here's the aside: A number of years ago, the book that was all the rage was Stephen Covey's The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People. He made this comment: "Management is doing things right; leadership is doing the right things." Then he gave this example, which I love: Imagine a group of producers cutting their way through the jungle with machetes. They are clearing out the underbrush. The managers are following, writing policies and procedures, conducting training programs, doing all the things that managers do to make sure that everything is efficient. The leader climbs the tallest tree, checks everything out, and then yells, "Wrong jungle!" And what do those bustling producers and efficient managers say? "Shut up! We're making progress!"
[If the goal is to be effective, then efficiency may "suffer." But if the goal is just to crow about progress, then damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead, and who cares about those ship lights ahead as we plow onward? But what if those lights are actually on a lighthouse, and the present course is going to put the boat aground on it?]
The next item was on the ditch closures, proper sizes of piping in the ditches and for driveway culverts, rules and regulations for that, and a fee/permit schedule. Jason pointed out that we are the only township that pays for this kind of work; the others pass that cost to the resident/owner. The best thing is not for all of this to be perhaps not accurately presented in the blog, but for residents who need such work to get the proper information from those properly responsible for it.
Jason thought that it should be possible to pass a resolution on this at tonight's meeting.
Vic asked about people grandfathered in--those who had asked for such work and were waiting for it to be done. It amounted to 14-15 people.
John Festa thought it [I am not sure what the "it" refers to] looked OK.
Jason read the resolution, which is quite detailed. Anyone who wants to understand it should get it from the minutes. He also made the motion to adopt it; John Festa seconded, and it passed.
Jason made a motion that people who have previously requested culverts be exempted from the permit requirement. Vic seconded; passed.
Then there was discussion about the fee schedule. Vic commented that he did not think John Vechery had seen that yet.
There was discussion about how a fee schedule had rather high charges for quite small buildings. Vic made a motion, which was seconded and passed. It is Resolution #85. Check the official minutes.
Mantua Township Trustees April 5, 2012: Trustees' Reports
John Festa inquired about how to rearrange the order of business that would end the meetings earlier. There was quite a bit of discussion about this. I do not find a motion regarding this in my notes, but the result I believe was that meetings will now begin at 7:15 with a call to order and then bills will be paid first.
So--to anyone planning to attend a meeting, unless you get there before 7:30, you will be walking in on a meeting in progress.
Vic announced that he had the fliers made up for spring cleanup. Dumpsters have been reserved. Date is Saturday, May 12, from 7:00 to 4:30. Center Road will be closed to southbound traffic at Diagonal Road for safety.
John Festa: I would like to ask for a special meeting for a security issue and employment issue that I have.
Jason corrected John--that he actually wants to have an executive session.
Vic: You will have to be more specific when we get to that point.
Vic said he had gone to an LAPC meeting at which Chesapeake [Energy?] made a presentation on the fracking water and chemicals used. Chesapeake has it down to 98% recycling for the fracking water.
Also: There was a handout on prescription drug disposal if people had unused drugs they needed to get rid of.
Vic had also heard from Randy Roberts, who had requested a letter from the trustees about a permit in the school building that expired on April 2. He has given the Township a couple of weeks to submit a letter requesting renewal and a completion date. This has to do with the basement and the parking area and a hand rail. He wants a commitment from us regarding the complex, and we need to put together a time frame.
Vic, continuing: I got a call on the sewer plant [at the school] from the EPA. They have inspected it, and someone new is handling this and would like to have a dechlorinating function added. Vic commented that it has never been on there. He contacted someone from Portage Septic who came and reviewed [the package
plant]. A 25-lb. bucket of tablets would be $95.00 and $310.00 for the dechlorinating unit--a total of about $500, with everything.I can install this, and Lou Richman will help. [Blogger: Ms. Richman apparently really understands such treatment systems and can be very helpful.]
I asked about sand, which we have not done for a couple of years. There is a new spec on that. I will call some gravel pits with the information. I would like to order that unit if I could.
Jason: Is there a reason that this has become an issue now?
Vic: I wanted to know about the size of the dechlorinating system because we are not using up to the capacity of the system. The EPA had some other issues. [Each person new to a situation adds a new wrinkle or requirement.] The dechlorinating is a new item; the rest is just maintenance.
[Blogger: FYI, when the Trustees purchased the school building, Vic went through the requirements to become certified to operate and maintain the little sewage treatment system at the school and has done so for the past 8 years. I have not determined how much money that has saved the Township.]
John Festa asked about the time frame; we have to begin the chlorinating May 1.
Jason commented that there was apparently no choice, since the EPA was mandating the work.
Vic: We have had to do the chlorinating right along. I probably have some of the fittings.
John Festa asked if a study had ever been done on tying in to the sewer line on Rt. 82.
Vic: It would take a grinder. For as long as we maintain it, it is a viable system.
Vic made the motion. Jason seconded, and it passed.
John Festa asked the name of the EPA rep because he has some other questions.
There was discussion about the winter salt purchase; the shed is full, but we still have to buy and pay for what we estimated at the beginning of the winter, or whenever all of that has to be done.
The lead person/CEO on the documents for public works had to be changed.
More about trash baskets: every supplier shows them, but no one seems to be able to get them. It will cost close to $1500.
There was also discussion about voting and tables. Vic made a motion to get what was required probably at Sam 's Club. Seconded and passed.
This segment ended at 8:45.
So--to anyone planning to attend a meeting, unless you get there before 7:30, you will be walking in on a meeting in progress.
Vic announced that he had the fliers made up for spring cleanup. Dumpsters have been reserved. Date is Saturday, May 12, from 7:00 to 4:30. Center Road will be closed to southbound traffic at Diagonal Road for safety.
John Festa: I would like to ask for a special meeting for a security issue and employment issue that I have.
Jason corrected John--that he actually wants to have an executive session.
Vic: You will have to be more specific when we get to that point.
Vic said he had gone to an LAPC meeting at which Chesapeake [Energy?] made a presentation on the fracking water and chemicals used. Chesapeake has it down to 98% recycling for the fracking water.
Also: There was a handout on prescription drug disposal if people had unused drugs they needed to get rid of.
Vic had also heard from Randy Roberts, who had requested a letter from the trustees about a permit in the school building that expired on April 2. He has given the Township a couple of weeks to submit a letter requesting renewal and a completion date. This has to do with the basement and the parking area and a hand rail. He wants a commitment from us regarding the complex, and we need to put together a time frame.
Vic, continuing: I got a call on the sewer plant [at the school] from the EPA. They have inspected it, and someone new is handling this and would like to have a dechlorinating function added. Vic commented that it has never been on there. He contacted someone from Portage Septic who came and reviewed [the package
plant]. A 25-lb. bucket of tablets would be $95.00 and $310.00 for the dechlorinating unit--a total of about $500, with everything.I can install this, and Lou Richman will help. [Blogger: Ms. Richman apparently really understands such treatment systems and can be very helpful.]
I asked about sand, which we have not done for a couple of years. There is a new spec on that. I will call some gravel pits with the information. I would like to order that unit if I could.
Jason: Is there a reason that this has become an issue now?
Vic: I wanted to know about the size of the dechlorinating system because we are not using up to the capacity of the system. The EPA had some other issues. [Each person new to a situation adds a new wrinkle or requirement.] The dechlorinating is a new item; the rest is just maintenance.
[Blogger: FYI, when the Trustees purchased the school building, Vic went through the requirements to become certified to operate and maintain the little sewage treatment system at the school and has done so for the past 8 years. I have not determined how much money that has saved the Township.]
John Festa asked about the time frame; we have to begin the chlorinating May 1.
Jason commented that there was apparently no choice, since the EPA was mandating the work.
Vic: We have had to do the chlorinating right along. I probably have some of the fittings.
John Festa asked if a study had ever been done on tying in to the sewer line on Rt. 82.
Vic: It would take a grinder. For as long as we maintain it, it is a viable system.
Vic made the motion. Jason seconded, and it passed.
John Festa asked the name of the EPA rep because he has some other questions.
There was discussion about the winter salt purchase; the shed is full, but we still have to buy and pay for what we estimated at the beginning of the winter, or whenever all of that has to be done.
The lead person/CEO on the documents for public works had to be changed.
More about trash baskets: every supplier shows them, but no one seems to be able to get them. It will cost close to $1500.
There was also discussion about voting and tables. Vic made a motion to get what was required probably at Sam 's Club. Seconded and passed.
This segment ended at 8:45.
Mantua Township Trustees, April 5, 2012: New Business
Marie Stehli commented about some recent records requests having gone unanswered because (a) she does not have a Township e-mail account and (b) has been blocked out of her own e-mail account for some reason. She does not take records requests via the Internet. Records requests have been successfully filled for the past 20 years by making a phone call or mailing a request. She apologized to Dan Cozzens regarding a request; she had lost his phone number.
Lynn Harvey announced that the next Zoning Commission meeting will include the Land Use Committee. The meeting will be in the gymnasium of the Center School building, at 7:30 p.m. on Thursday, April 12.
The purpose of the meeting is to update everyone on what is going on and how the Land Use Plan fits with everything and the new zoning book.
The public is invited.
Joan Martin, Chairperson of the Board of Zoning Appeals, said that she had some concerns after the meeting on March 19 and requested an All Boards meeting: Zoning, BZA, and Trustees. The date was finally set for Thursday, April 24, at the Township Hall, after some backing and filling: Jason did not have his calendar with him. These meetings are usually conducted by the Trustees.
Garden Club and LCA both reported. Garden Club will meet at 6:30 on April 18 in the Township Hall to begin getting ready for the spring plant sale. Donations of plants are welcomed. The sale is Saturday, June 2, from 9-2 on the green.
LCA has two red maple trees to plant in memory of Ila Turner and Amy Janka's mother.
Jason presented bids/proposals for fertilizing and spraying various lawns and the ball fields. [See public comment for more on this topic.] The original plan was to have four applications, with spraying for broadleaf weeds in September. Lawn Matters quoted $235 for each application. Todd Monroe broke his into $167 (or $168--there is a cross-out in my notes) and $153 per application. The mowing is a separate contract and price.
Marie: Lawn care for last year took the entire budget for parks and the Township Hall. I wanted to let you know we are already out of money on this.
Jason asked how much short we are.
Marie: I pulled most of it out of the cemetery [fund]. But that wiped out the -- services account and the Civic Center and Parks account. This came to about $5100. I have taken about $1,000 out for the website. We have $4500 budgeted for spring cleanup. There is no place else to take it from. Everything is tight this year.
Jason: What is in the General Fund for the school?
Marie: Repairs and maintenance: $3500 left.
Jason: I just wanted the General Fund.
Marie: That is basically where all the school money is from. Marie went through the expenses. She said that possibly some could be taken from the electricity account.
Jason suggested taking $2,000 out of the electricity account.
Marie commented about budgeting for next year.
Jason made the motion to move the $2,000. John Festa seconded. Passed.
That took care of where the money would come from to pay for the chemicals. Vic then asked about possibly cutting down on some of the expense, and Jason thought that one application could be eliminated. He also commented on some other things Todd Monroe had mentioned, saying that we could wait until the end of the year.
Jason then proposed that the bid from Todd Monroe be accepted, because his price was better--more chemicals for the money. [Blogger: Is that slanted language in the last phrase? Yes. Terri and Lynn both addressed this in public comment.] Vic clarified that conditioning the ball fields would be a decision deferred until fall.
John Festa seconded; the motion passed.
Various other things were discussed: marking Center Road, advertising for contractors and equipment that the Township might need during the year, properly dating the forms, and open the bids on May 6. Discussion also on the wording of the ads and the dates to run them.
New Business ended at 8:19.
Lynn Harvey announced that the next Zoning Commission meeting will include the Land Use Committee. The meeting will be in the gymnasium of the Center School building, at 7:30 p.m. on Thursday, April 12.
The purpose of the meeting is to update everyone on what is going on and how the Land Use Plan fits with everything and the new zoning book.
The public is invited.
Joan Martin, Chairperson of the Board of Zoning Appeals, said that she had some concerns after the meeting on March 19 and requested an All Boards meeting: Zoning, BZA, and Trustees. The date was finally set for Thursday, April 24, at the Township Hall, after some backing and filling: Jason did not have his calendar with him. These meetings are usually conducted by the Trustees.
Garden Club and LCA both reported. Garden Club will meet at 6:30 on April 18 in the Township Hall to begin getting ready for the spring plant sale. Donations of plants are welcomed. The sale is Saturday, June 2, from 9-2 on the green.
LCA has two red maple trees to plant in memory of Ila Turner and Amy Janka's mother.
Jason presented bids/proposals for fertilizing and spraying various lawns and the ball fields. [See public comment for more on this topic.] The original plan was to have four applications, with spraying for broadleaf weeds in September. Lawn Matters quoted $235 for each application. Todd Monroe broke his into $167 (or $168--there is a cross-out in my notes) and $153 per application. The mowing is a separate contract and price.
Marie: Lawn care for last year took the entire budget for parks and the Township Hall. I wanted to let you know we are already out of money on this.
Jason asked how much short we are.
Marie: I pulled most of it out of the cemetery [fund]. But that wiped out the -- services account and the Civic Center and Parks account. This came to about $5100. I have taken about $1,000 out for the website. We have $4500 budgeted for spring cleanup. There is no place else to take it from. Everything is tight this year.
Jason: What is in the General Fund for the school?
Marie: Repairs and maintenance: $3500 left.
Jason: I just wanted the General Fund.
Marie: That is basically where all the school money is from. Marie went through the expenses. She said that possibly some could be taken from the electricity account.
Jason suggested taking $2,000 out of the electricity account.
Marie commented about budgeting for next year.
Jason made the motion to move the $2,000. John Festa seconded. Passed.
That took care of where the money would come from to pay for the chemicals. Vic then asked about possibly cutting down on some of the expense, and Jason thought that one application could be eliminated. He also commented on some other things Todd Monroe had mentioned, saying that we could wait until the end of the year.
Jason then proposed that the bid from Todd Monroe be accepted, because his price was better--more chemicals for the money. [Blogger: Is that slanted language in the last phrase? Yes. Terri and Lynn both addressed this in public comment.] Vic clarified that conditioning the ball fields would be a decision deferred until fall.
John Festa seconded; the motion passed.
Various other things were discussed: marking Center Road, advertising for contractors and equipment that the Township might need during the year, properly dating the forms, and open the bids on May 6. Discussion also on the wording of the ads and the dates to run them.
New Business ended at 8:19.
Tuesday, April 10, 2012
Public Comment, Pt. 3, Mantua Twp. Trustees Mtg. April 5, 2012
Dawn Pechman spoke after Nick Ehlert read his letter (Public Comment, Part 1) and Jason commented about various refurbishings done by volunteers.
Dawn Pechman: Marie, the minutes indicate that money was earmarked for the school. How much money and how was it earmarked?
Marie: $121, 224 from the estate taxes to be used for the project at the school. There was a NOPEC grant which paid for Township Hall windows and work [boiler(s) and a door, possibly windows, I (blogger) believe] for the school.
Money earned from the lease purchase loan for the school was used for the school.
Dawn: Was it appropriated?
Marie: It was in the general fund.
Dawn: Regarding copies, this is something that needs to be addressed for people wanting copies. [Background: In the process of setting up the accounts for the Township's website, a glitch of some kind has blocked Marie out of the e-mail. Dawn has been trying to use that account and has gotten no response because Marie wasn't able to access it.]
Marie: You have been getting copies since September 2004 and have never had a problem before. [Note: Dawn has gotten at least hundreds if not thousands of copies and has complained the whole time about not getting them when and as she wants them. She has also requested copies, not just of Marie, and has never picked them up--not just once, but a number of times. She has made appointments to get copies but has not shown up at the agreed-upon time.]
Dawn: In 1998 Rick Pemberton asked for ?? [Blogger: Sorry. I missed that word. It didn't seem crucial that we were now being taken back to the previous century in an attempt to be critical.] I [Dawn] have been chastised for calling you after business hours. Perhaps the Township can provide Internet capabilities. I have requested financial records for the school. [Yes, and got them--17 pages.]
Jason: Would it be possible, Dawn, to make that request verbally after Public Comment?
Dawn: I did not bring the list with me.
Marie: Call or request it by mail.
Dawn: Since 1998 I [we?] have had difficulty getting records.
Dawn: The Land Use Committee is going to meet for the first time in more than 11 years. I would like to ask based on the resolution when the Land Use Committee was appointed--it has been defunct for 11 years--that it is time for the Trustees to appoint a new Land Use Committee.
Continuing: The All Boards Meeting is something that has just come up in the last 10 years. I would ask that the All Boards meeting be cancelled and each board operate on its own.
Steve Zielinski and Dan Cozzens: No comment.
Dave Pollard: Jason, did I understand that you are going to discuss my offer of salvage on that building?
Jason: Yes. We are going to go into executive session and then will discuss that.
[Note: Dave offered a payment to salvage the shed in the cemetery that Jason and John Festa had decided at the previous meeting to tear down. The decision is included in the posts for that meeting.]
Dave, continuing: One other thing--Even just driving past Westlawn and at Eastlawn, there are probably three dozen flags on veterans' markers that are being flown in an inappropriate or disrespectful manner. Flag protocol says that a damaged flag should be taken down. I know that a lot of cemeteries remove them at the end of the winter. I would like to ask the Trustees to contact whoever is responsible or that they take care of it.
Vic: I will contact John Vechery about this.
Dave: It looks as if some new ones have been put up but the damaged ones have been left.
9:40 -- Motion to pay the bills.
Dawn Pechman: Marie, the minutes indicate that money was earmarked for the school. How much money and how was it earmarked?
Marie: $121, 224 from the estate taxes to be used for the project at the school. There was a NOPEC grant which paid for Township Hall windows and work [boiler(s) and a door, possibly windows, I (blogger) believe] for the school.
Money earned from the lease purchase loan for the school was used for the school.
Dawn: Was it appropriated?
Marie: It was in the general fund.
Dawn: Regarding copies, this is something that needs to be addressed for people wanting copies. [Background: In the process of setting up the accounts for the Township's website, a glitch of some kind has blocked Marie out of the e-mail. Dawn has been trying to use that account and has gotten no response because Marie wasn't able to access it.]
Marie: You have been getting copies since September 2004 and have never had a problem before. [Note: Dawn has gotten at least hundreds if not thousands of copies and has complained the whole time about not getting them when and as she wants them. She has also requested copies, not just of Marie, and has never picked them up--not just once, but a number of times. She has made appointments to get copies but has not shown up at the agreed-upon time.]
Dawn: In 1998 Rick Pemberton asked for ?? [Blogger: Sorry. I missed that word. It didn't seem crucial that we were now being taken back to the previous century in an attempt to be critical.] I [Dawn] have been chastised for calling you after business hours. Perhaps the Township can provide Internet capabilities. I have requested financial records for the school. [Yes, and got them--17 pages.]
Jason: Would it be possible, Dawn, to make that request verbally after Public Comment?
Dawn: I did not bring the list with me.
Marie: Call or request it by mail.
Dawn: Since 1998 I [we?] have had difficulty getting records.
Dawn: The Land Use Committee is going to meet for the first time in more than 11 years. I would like to ask based on the resolution when the Land Use Committee was appointed--it has been defunct for 11 years--that it is time for the Trustees to appoint a new Land Use Committee.
Continuing: The All Boards Meeting is something that has just come up in the last 10 years. I would ask that the All Boards meeting be cancelled and each board operate on its own.
Steve Zielinski and Dan Cozzens: No comment.
Dave Pollard: Jason, did I understand that you are going to discuss my offer of salvage on that building?
Jason: Yes. We are going to go into executive session and then will discuss that.
[Note: Dave offered a payment to salvage the shed in the cemetery that Jason and John Festa had decided at the previous meeting to tear down. The decision is included in the posts for that meeting.]
Dave, continuing: One other thing--Even just driving past Westlawn and at Eastlawn, there are probably three dozen flags on veterans' markers that are being flown in an inappropriate or disrespectful manner. Flag protocol says that a damaged flag should be taken down. I know that a lot of cemeteries remove them at the end of the winter. I would like to ask the Trustees to contact whoever is responsible or that they take care of it.
Vic: I will contact John Vechery about this.
Dave: It looks as if some new ones have been put up but the damaged ones have been left.
9:40 -- Motion to pay the bills.
Public Comment, Pt. 2, Mantua Twp. Trustees April 5, 2012
Terri Vechery and Lynn Harvey both addressed the bulk of their remarks to the decision to put fertilizer and herbicides on the ball field again this year.
Terri Vechery: I was wondering if all work had been completed in the garage and if so, you could forward me information so that I can put an article in the Community Journal.
Jason: Work is complete and painting is being done.
Terri: I would like dollar amounts and particulars.
Terri: Second, can you clarify what is going to be done on the ball field regarding spraying? Is it going to be fertilizing and spraying?
Jason: There will be three applications to the ball field(s) of 13-0-7 fertilizer and crab grass control. In September the third application will be done.
Terri: Did you notify the coaches and parents? Last year I talked to people and learned that this was the only park they played in [that was treated] and they were shocked to learn this. They were never talked to.
Jason: I will contact the organizations and let them reach out to them. [Blogger: This sounds good; I wonder if the information will get to the people who really need it.]
Terri: You have heard from Lynn Harvey and Carole Pollard --we are the only field that does this.
Jason reiterated Todd Monroe's qualifications and listed the other fields that he has treated.
Barb Herbold had no comment; I was next and will present my comments subsequently; Nick Ehlert read the letter that is Part 1 of Public Comment; Dawn Pechman commented next. Lynn Harvey spoke after Dawn.
Lynn Harvey: I would like to weigh in on the pesticide and spraying issue. I think a lot of people are under the impression that the government has tested these [chemicals] and think that they are safe. What people don't realize is that a lot of the organic chemicals that we take in during our daily life build up in our bodies. If we took a tissue sample, many [chemicals] would show up in our bodies. Every one of us is a human guinea pig because of our modern life. Some people clear these chemicals out better than others. The most vulnerable are children. The parents need to be notified. This is not the only chemical they [children] are exposed to. [Note: Lynn advised notifying the parents. Jason said, in response to Terri, that he would notify the organization(s).]
[Blogger: To readers who have children or grandchildren who play in Little League, there are two things you might do: First, take a look at the Living on Earth website to see what you can find about this issue of chemicals, their buildup, and especially how children are affected. Second, act upon what you have learned if it concerns you.]
Carole Pollard: [My remarks are paraphrased; they were neither lengthy enough nor tightly constructed enough to require being written out and read.]
I want to address something that was said at the last meeting about the Open House Committee for the Mantua Center School. An ad hoc committee is one appointed by the governing body for a specific purpose. We were not appointed; we were a completely volunteer committee and therefore are not subject to the sunshine laws. In fact, we may have sparked the rash of volunteerism in the Township.
In my opinion, the reference to the sunshine laws at the last meeting in relation to the Open House Committee was a smoke screen intended to draw attention away from an actual infraction [of the sunshine laws.]
[OK. Here is the rest of the story. You might want to take a quick look at my remarks and notes in the last meeting, when I identified John Festa's "forgetting" to give a letter to Marie as precisely relating to the sunshine laws.
During Public Comment at that meeting, Dawn demanded records from the Open House Committee and said that if that was an ad hoc committee, she was the Queen of England. She was right about our not being an ad hoc committee, but in context, it looks as if she didn't understand the definition of such a committee as given in Roberts Rules of Order. She also tied the Committee's not providing records to the sunshine laws, reminding everyone that it was Sunshine Law Week. Because it is not possible to rebut a remark after one has made public comment, I dealt with it at this meeting.
So--just to make it perfectly clear: John Festa as an elected official is bound by the sunshine laws--or should be. The Open House Committee, as a completely volunteer group, is not so bound. The infraction was his, not ours.]
Terri Vechery: I was wondering if all work had been completed in the garage and if so, you could forward me information so that I can put an article in the Community Journal.
Jason: Work is complete and painting is being done.
Terri: I would like dollar amounts and particulars.
Terri: Second, can you clarify what is going to be done on the ball field regarding spraying? Is it going to be fertilizing and spraying?
Jason: There will be three applications to the ball field(s) of 13-0-7 fertilizer and crab grass control. In September the third application will be done.
Terri: Did you notify the coaches and parents? Last year I talked to people and learned that this was the only park they played in [that was treated] and they were shocked to learn this. They were never talked to.
Jason: I will contact the organizations and let them reach out to them. [Blogger: This sounds good; I wonder if the information will get to the people who really need it.]
Terri: You have heard from Lynn Harvey and Carole Pollard --we are the only field that does this.
Jason reiterated Todd Monroe's qualifications and listed the other fields that he has treated.
Barb Herbold had no comment; I was next and will present my comments subsequently; Nick Ehlert read the letter that is Part 1 of Public Comment; Dawn Pechman commented next. Lynn Harvey spoke after Dawn.
Lynn Harvey: I would like to weigh in on the pesticide and spraying issue. I think a lot of people are under the impression that the government has tested these [chemicals] and think that they are safe. What people don't realize is that a lot of the organic chemicals that we take in during our daily life build up in our bodies. If we took a tissue sample, many [chemicals] would show up in our bodies. Every one of us is a human guinea pig because of our modern life. Some people clear these chemicals out better than others. The most vulnerable are children. The parents need to be notified. This is not the only chemical they [children] are exposed to. [Note: Lynn advised notifying the parents. Jason said, in response to Terri, that he would notify the organization(s).]
[Blogger: To readers who have children or grandchildren who play in Little League, there are two things you might do: First, take a look at the Living on Earth website to see what you can find about this issue of chemicals, their buildup, and especially how children are affected. Second, act upon what you have learned if it concerns you.]
Carole Pollard: [My remarks are paraphrased; they were neither lengthy enough nor tightly constructed enough to require being written out and read.]
I want to address something that was said at the last meeting about the Open House Committee for the Mantua Center School. An ad hoc committee is one appointed by the governing body for a specific purpose. We were not appointed; we were a completely volunteer committee and therefore are not subject to the sunshine laws. In fact, we may have sparked the rash of volunteerism in the Township.
In my opinion, the reference to the sunshine laws at the last meeting in relation to the Open House Committee was a smoke screen intended to draw attention away from an actual infraction [of the sunshine laws.]
[OK. Here is the rest of the story. You might want to take a quick look at my remarks and notes in the last meeting, when I identified John Festa's "forgetting" to give a letter to Marie as precisely relating to the sunshine laws.
During Public Comment at that meeting, Dawn demanded records from the Open House Committee and said that if that was an ad hoc committee, she was the Queen of England. She was right about our not being an ad hoc committee, but in context, it looks as if she didn't understand the definition of such a committee as given in Roberts Rules of Order. She also tied the Committee's not providing records to the sunshine laws, reminding everyone that it was Sunshine Law Week. Because it is not possible to rebut a remark after one has made public comment, I dealt with it at this meeting.
So--just to make it perfectly clear: John Festa as an elected official is bound by the sunshine laws--or should be. The Open House Committee, as a completely volunteer group, is not so bound. The infraction was his, not ours.]
Saturday, April 7, 2012
Public Comment, Mantua Twp. Trustees April 5, 2012
For the April 5 meeting posts, Public Comment will be the "hook" for additional significant information from the business meeting, and things will be organized in similar topics and concerns where possible, not just sequentially like beads on a string. Like "beads" will be with like "beads."
Public Comment began at 9:16. Terri Vechery and Carole Pollard spoke first, in that order. Nick Ehlert's comments followed theirs, which will be in a subsequent post. Nick read the following letter, here in its entirety. The letter, Nick's introductory remarks, and two related follow-ons, are the sum and substance of this post.
Nick: My wife was supposed to be here, but she has taken our granddaughter to the hospital [to have a sports injury checked, I (blogger) believe]. My wife is in the process of identifying old historical buildings and has been in touch with the Ohio Preservation Office and the National Park Service. Two members of the Ohio Preservation Office came to the last meeting of the Downtown Mantua Revitalization Committee to discuss preservation.
April 5, 2012
To: Mantua Township Trustees
From: Nick and Linda Ehlert
As members of the Mantua Historical Society we would like to compliment the Trustees for the preservation work done on the interior of the Town Hall and Eastlawn cemetery gate, as well as the restoration on the Village School bell and the World War II veterans sign.
While working with the Downtown Mantua Revitalization Committee we came across a 1974 letter from the Ohio Historic Preservation Office informing the Township that the Mantua Center Historic District had been entered in the National Register of Historic Places by the National Park Service, Department of Interior. This was done to "recognize the importance of and need for the careful and sensible preservation of Ohio's landmarks."
It has been brought to our attention that there are discussions going on to alter or modify these historic buildings to comply with the American Disability Act. Before any modifications are made the Ohio Historic Preservation Office strongly encourages the owners of historic properties to consider all options before completing work that could damage the structure or impair its historic integrity. The Ohio Historic Preservation Office upon request, provides information on how to sensitively rehabilitate and repair historic properties. They prefer to guide the projects and are eager to help in any way possible. They have lists of architects and contractors accustomed to working to preserve historic structures with the least amount of damage done to the integrity of the building and can possibly help make the changes at a lesser cost than expected.
Please find enclosed standards and guidelines for rehabilitating historic structures as outlined by the National Park Service. Also included is some explanation of the provision of the ADA act that allows exceptions for historical buildings in order to maintain the significance of the building.
Some examples of buildings not required to meet ADA standards can be seen in Burton, Kirtland and Peninsula, Ohio.
To gain a greater understanding of the applicable building codes for historic buildings, I visited Portage County Building Dept. director Randy Roberts on Monday April 2, 2012. He told me that there are no requirements to make any ADA changes to existing buildings unless you are otherwise altering them. Even then, provisions of Code #3409 and #3411.9 (see attachments) allow exceptions for historic buildings.
It is of utmost importance that we continue to preserve the historical integrity of ALL the old Township buildings.
Properties listed in the National Historic Register as well as those determined eligible for listing are given special consideration in the planning of federally funded or licensed projects and/or grants.
Our past and future have been and will continue to be connected by these buildings, they deserve to be handled with great care.
For further information or questions on how to best proceed with changes, feel free to call:
Franco Ruffini
Deputy State Historic Preservation Officer
Ohio Historic Preservation Office
614-298-2000
Respectfully submitted,
Linda Ehlert (signature)
Nicholas Ehlert (signature)
Linda and Nicholas Ehlert
Mantua Township Residents
Mantua Historical Society members
Enclosures: 9
cc: Mantua Historical Society
Jason Carlton immediately upon Nick's completing the letter recognized the work that had been done on the bell (mentioned in Nick and Linda's letter). Jason commented that Larry Lietzow was the spearhead behind this as well as the Historical Society and did an excellent job along with Mr. Parsons.
[Blogger's note: A member of the DMRC who knows of my interest in the Mantua Center School building invited me to attend the DMRC meeting that Nick mentioned. In discussion of restoring old buildings, plastic/vinyl copies of historical architectural features were mentioned. The two representatives from the Ohio Preservation Office cringed.]
Public Comment began at 9:16. Terri Vechery and Carole Pollard spoke first, in that order. Nick Ehlert's comments followed theirs, which will be in a subsequent post. Nick read the following letter, here in its entirety. The letter, Nick's introductory remarks, and two related follow-ons, are the sum and substance of this post.
Nick: My wife was supposed to be here, but she has taken our granddaughter to the hospital [to have a sports injury checked, I (blogger) believe]. My wife is in the process of identifying old historical buildings and has been in touch with the Ohio Preservation Office and the National Park Service. Two members of the Ohio Preservation Office came to the last meeting of the Downtown Mantua Revitalization Committee to discuss preservation.
April 5, 2012
To: Mantua Township Trustees
From: Nick and Linda Ehlert
As members of the Mantua Historical Society we would like to compliment the Trustees for the preservation work done on the interior of the Town Hall and Eastlawn cemetery gate, as well as the restoration on the Village School bell and the World War II veterans sign.
While working with the Downtown Mantua Revitalization Committee we came across a 1974 letter from the Ohio Historic Preservation Office informing the Township that the Mantua Center Historic District had been entered in the National Register of Historic Places by the National Park Service, Department of Interior. This was done to "recognize the importance of and need for the careful and sensible preservation of Ohio's landmarks."
It has been brought to our attention that there are discussions going on to alter or modify these historic buildings to comply with the American Disability Act. Before any modifications are made the Ohio Historic Preservation Office strongly encourages the owners of historic properties to consider all options before completing work that could damage the structure or impair its historic integrity. The Ohio Historic Preservation Office upon request, provides information on how to sensitively rehabilitate and repair historic properties. They prefer to guide the projects and are eager to help in any way possible. They have lists of architects and contractors accustomed to working to preserve historic structures with the least amount of damage done to the integrity of the building and can possibly help make the changes at a lesser cost than expected.
Please find enclosed standards and guidelines for rehabilitating historic structures as outlined by the National Park Service. Also included is some explanation of the provision of the ADA act that allows exceptions for historical buildings in order to maintain the significance of the building.
Some examples of buildings not required to meet ADA standards can be seen in Burton, Kirtland and Peninsula, Ohio.
To gain a greater understanding of the applicable building codes for historic buildings, I visited Portage County Building Dept. director Randy Roberts on Monday April 2, 2012. He told me that there are no requirements to make any ADA changes to existing buildings unless you are otherwise altering them. Even then, provisions of Code #3409 and #3411.9 (see attachments) allow exceptions for historic buildings.
It is of utmost importance that we continue to preserve the historical integrity of ALL the old Township buildings.
Properties listed in the National Historic Register as well as those determined eligible for listing are given special consideration in the planning of federally funded or licensed projects and/or grants.
Our past and future have been and will continue to be connected by these buildings, they deserve to be handled with great care.
For further information or questions on how to best proceed with changes, feel free to call:
Franco Ruffini
Deputy State Historic Preservation Officer
Ohio Historic Preservation Office
614-298-2000
Respectfully submitted,
Linda Ehlert (signature)
Nicholas Ehlert (signature)
Linda and Nicholas Ehlert
Mantua Township Residents
Mantua Historical Society members
Enclosures: 9
cc: Mantua Historical Society
Jason Carlton immediately upon Nick's completing the letter recognized the work that had been done on the bell (mentioned in Nick and Linda's letter). Jason commented that Larry Lietzow was the spearhead behind this as well as the Historical Society and did an excellent job along with Mr. Parsons.
[Blogger's note: A member of the DMRC who knows of my interest in the Mantua Center School building invited me to attend the DMRC meeting that Nick mentioned. In discussion of restoring old buildings, plastic/vinyl copies of historical architectural features were mentioned. The two representatives from the Ohio Preservation Office cringed.]
Thursday, April 5, 2012
If You're New
My intention for today's posts was to enter the one below this one and then give some kind of chatty, folksy intro in this entry. Actually, the post does it. Beyond that, if any of this blog interests you enough, the sidebar listing previous posts has a number of "If You're New" entries. That should be enough perspective for anyone!
So if you're new, I hope what you read here is worth your time and thought, and that you come back..
So if you're new, I hope what you read here is worth your time and thought, and that you come back..
Who Thinks for You?
When I was teaching, a propaganda unit was included in one of the courses. What I learned while teaching that course has served me well ever since, especially during political campaigns and in threading through all kinds of claims and assertions and allegations and claims of virtue on the one side and accusations of perfidy on the other. To put it in the vernacular, it has helped me sort the flyspecks from the pepper.
This post isn't going to be a quickie on propaganda techniques, even though it is especially tempting on this particular day. Instead, it's an excerpt from the last chapter of a quirky, interesting little book titled The Philosopher's Diet, by Richard Watson. The philosophy was more interesting to me than the weight loss advice, and his closing chapter--all two pages of it--was the most interesting of all.
To me, it is relevant across time and topic.
"If you want to enjoy your life, pay attention to what you are doing. Control as much of your life as you can. Live in full consciousness. And don't stop thinking for yourself. If you don't think for yourself, you will be someone's slave. Or dead.
"Yes, there are masters and slaves. Descartes thought there were also two other kinds of people: those concerned with learning things and those concerned with making money. The dichotomy has been remarkably persistent among philosophers who have tried to understand human nature and society. The dividing line--like that between life and death--is apparently a knife's edge. There are those who seek knowledge and those who seek power; dreamers and merchants, professors and politicians. Of course, some philosophers have beaten their pens into swords, but on the whole, philosophers write books rather than sign orders of exile and execution. . . .
[Descartes] "was one of those philosophers whose faith in reason was so strong that he thought that by writing a book he could change the world." (pp. 107-109.)
That perhaps naive faith in reason, and the decision to hold to the idea that good prevails are why I do this blog.
"My mind is made up--don't confuse me with facts" isn't funny. It's the way a lot of people live their lives, and it's certainly simpler than doing the hard work of thinking.
My own mind is made up about the value of reason and the force of good. I support the position of a number of people while wishing that they would do or had done things differently--but the touchstone is whether they are good human beings, flawed as we all are, but doing their level best for the highest good of all concerned, not for personal gain or glory.
You don't need a course in propaganda techniques to be able to sort them out, either. You just need to observe--and think for yourself.
This post isn't going to be a quickie on propaganda techniques, even though it is especially tempting on this particular day. Instead, it's an excerpt from the last chapter of a quirky, interesting little book titled The Philosopher's Diet, by Richard Watson. The philosophy was more interesting to me than the weight loss advice, and his closing chapter--all two pages of it--was the most interesting of all.
To me, it is relevant across time and topic.
"If you want to enjoy your life, pay attention to what you are doing. Control as much of your life as you can. Live in full consciousness. And don't stop thinking for yourself. If you don't think for yourself, you will be someone's slave. Or dead.
"Yes, there are masters and slaves. Descartes thought there were also two other kinds of people: those concerned with learning things and those concerned with making money. The dichotomy has been remarkably persistent among philosophers who have tried to understand human nature and society. The dividing line--like that between life and death--is apparently a knife's edge. There are those who seek knowledge and those who seek power; dreamers and merchants, professors and politicians. Of course, some philosophers have beaten their pens into swords, but on the whole, philosophers write books rather than sign orders of exile and execution. . . .
[Descartes] "was one of those philosophers whose faith in reason was so strong that he thought that by writing a book he could change the world." (pp. 107-109.)
That perhaps naive faith in reason, and the decision to hold to the idea that good prevails are why I do this blog.
"My mind is made up--don't confuse me with facts" isn't funny. It's the way a lot of people live their lives, and it's certainly simpler than doing the hard work of thinking.
My own mind is made up about the value of reason and the force of good. I support the position of a number of people while wishing that they would do or had done things differently--but the touchstone is whether they are good human beings, flawed as we all are, but doing their level best for the highest good of all concerned, not for personal gain or glory.
You don't need a course in propaganda techniques to be able to sort them out, either. You just need to observe--and think for yourself.
Monday, April 2, 2012
Dave's Post for April 2
Both sides gave it all their best
When they met at "The Hornets' Nest."
Their cannon fire shook the ground
And apple blossoms came gently down
Upon the dead at Shiloh. April 7, 1862
When they met at "The Hornets' Nest."
Their cannon fire shook the ground
And apple blossoms came gently down
Upon the dead at Shiloh. April 7, 1862
Risky Business
Since the early '90's, 94 journalists have been murdered in Iraq, 24 in Pakistan, and 12 in Afghanistan, not just because they were in dangerous places. They were targeted. Those are just three sample countries.
What does THAT have to do with Mantua Township?
A whole lot, really.
Yes, those journalists were in dangerous areas. But they were perceived as dangerous because their jobs put them at odds with someone who disagreed with what they were saying. It didn't matter which side they were on. Someone didn't like what they were saying, whether it was telling the government position or protesting it. They were silenced.
One of the blackest villains in all of literature, Shakespeare's Iago, murders his own wife because she exposes his lies--which had enmeshed almost every character in Othello in misery and murder. The great irony is that it is Iago--Iago!--who bewails the loss of his reputation. Go figure--but it all sounds very familiar, very contemporary. Close to home, even.
Oh, great--Shakespeare. Now she's lecturing us on Shakespeare.
Yep. If you can only have two books for your whole life, the only two you need are the Bible and Shakespeare. All of human nobility and moral corruption--the whole spectrum--are right there.
We say that telling the truth is noble and courageous, that honesty is the best policy, but when that truth tears off the mask created by lies, the liar's response is rage.
Rage, and a fine display of moral indignation. The one who has laid it out there straight is demonized.
In despotic countries, journalists are killed. In Mantua Township, demands are made every few years that Dave stop putting up his limericks, or that he be stopped. The demands--excuse me, the negotiations--have now expanded to include this blog--such a surprise!
Some years ago, when a number of people (usually women living alone, I think) answered their doors to find a stranger pushing into their homes, I went to Burton and investigated personal protection. One of the guys hanging out in the shop said, "When it's all said and done, you want the only story to be yours."
When it comes to taking care of yourself, that's almost an article of faith in this country: we have the right to protect ourselves. But demanding only one point of view--one story--in civic life means that we are either living under tyranny or are dealing with people who would be tyrants. Dishonesty requires concealment.
I thought that our high school government classes were supposed to teach us better than that. Or are "We the people" and freedom of expression--the First Amendment--only for some people?
What does THAT have to do with Mantua Township?
A whole lot, really.
Yes, those journalists were in dangerous areas. But they were perceived as dangerous because their jobs put them at odds with someone who disagreed with what they were saying. It didn't matter which side they were on. Someone didn't like what they were saying, whether it was telling the government position or protesting it. They were silenced.
One of the blackest villains in all of literature, Shakespeare's Iago, murders his own wife because she exposes his lies--which had enmeshed almost every character in Othello in misery and murder. The great irony is that it is Iago--Iago!--who bewails the loss of his reputation. Go figure--but it all sounds very familiar, very contemporary. Close to home, even.
Oh, great--Shakespeare. Now she's lecturing us on Shakespeare.
Yep. If you can only have two books for your whole life, the only two you need are the Bible and Shakespeare. All of human nobility and moral corruption--the whole spectrum--are right there.
We say that telling the truth is noble and courageous, that honesty is the best policy, but when that truth tears off the mask created by lies, the liar's response is rage.
Rage, and a fine display of moral indignation. The one who has laid it out there straight is demonized.
In despotic countries, journalists are killed. In Mantua Township, demands are made every few years that Dave stop putting up his limericks, or that he be stopped. The demands--excuse me, the negotiations--have now expanded to include this blog--such a surprise!
Some years ago, when a number of people (usually women living alone, I think) answered their doors to find a stranger pushing into their homes, I went to Burton and investigated personal protection. One of the guys hanging out in the shop said, "When it's all said and done, you want the only story to be yours."
When it comes to taking care of yourself, that's almost an article of faith in this country: we have the right to protect ourselves. But demanding only one point of view--one story--in civic life means that we are either living under tyranny or are dealing with people who would be tyrants. Dishonesty requires concealment.
I thought that our high school government classes were supposed to teach us better than that. Or are "We the people" and freedom of expression--the First Amendment--only for some people?
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