[Foreword to the foreword: This post has now been completed and also has had additions made where I thought things needed to be a bit clearer or where another detail or two was important. Those additions are in italics. The point at which the final parts were added will be clearly marked.]
[Blogger Foreword: Although the titles are different, this post and the one below it are identical. I am afraid to delete either one for fear of losing them both. An explanation of how it happened wouldn't be even mildly entertaining.]
Cal Brant: What about the inside color of the door?
John Festa: The same thing as the wall color?
Cal: All the time I have spent here, about 8 weeks: the accidents that have occurred here--it is the stupidity of the people who won't wait. There is a guy in a pickup truck that I swear waits for someone to come and then he guns it. People pull out in front of traffic because they are too impatient. The other day I almost set the lift down on someone who was cutting through this area.
[Blogger: There was a question about the door handle on the new door, but I did not hear the answer.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: In light of the accident that occurred over here a few weeks ago, and by the way if you have any spare traffic cones in the garage it might not be a bad idea to put 3 or 4 across there [the driveway at the Township Hall while work is being done.]
I was at the Corners with the tractor [hauling hay] and there was a guy in the left turn lane who passed me from the left turn lane in the intersection. But if you put up traffic lights at every intersection in this township, you will not have a rural township. It would be better to have people lobby the state.
What signs are we getting for this grant?
Jason: Stop signs, arrow signs, different varieties. Speed limit signs. They will replace existing signs. They will be high reflectivity signs.
Dave: We need a good half dozen that say Dangerous Intersection.
Jason: They are available. But this was done way back.
Dave: I brought this up back when it was first mentioned. This is a safety issue and the trustees are charged with the safety of the residents.
Jason: We can still get them. [Blogger note: If you remember, not enough money had been allocated for the signs, and it had to be moved from other places. Dave made that point: that certainly they could be purchased now, but that the opportunity to get them under the grant was now past.]
Dave: That doesn't enhance the safety. [Blogger: This is what my notes say. I will check the recording to see if anything didn't make it into the notes, or whether context will make it possible to insert clarification.]
Note: At this point, Larry Leitzow or someone who sounds like him muttered audibly, "Jesus Christ."
Dave: A new stop sign is still just a stop sign.
There was some debate and discussion about this.
Dave: Did you read Judith Sutherland's column in Farm and Dairy today? Her column today was about responsible leadership. You cited an attorney's opinion that the zoning book could not be defended in a court of law--that attorney was not the township's counsel. That was smoke and mirrors. [Blogger: I believe that the smoke and mirrors referred more to Jason's remark than to the attorney's--another of many attempts to take refuge behind some semblance of authority, rather than taking an accountable stand.]
Jason: If you want to put me on the spot for mentioning someone's opinion--
[At this point, Dave and Jason both began talking over each other, which is impossible to get on the spot in notes. I will listen and see if I can capture some if not all of that exchange, which ended with Jason simply calling on Steve Zielinski. But it won't be right now. I am very grateful for having three weeks between meetings this month and will finish up within a day or so.]
Blogger: I listened to the recording. It is impossible in writing to convey a simultaneous exchange with opposing positions. Here are the pieces parts.
Dave: The attorney whose opinion you cited is not the counsel to the township. His opinion is irrelevant because he is not the township's legal counsel. After 5 years as a trustee you should know that. Our legal counsel has said he could defend it because he was involved in this [the zoning book rewrite] from the beginning. You were trying to support your Zoning Inspector at the expense of the Zoning Commission.
Jason: That is your opinion. [Blogger: Jason's dismissal of choice is to call something an opinion, as if all were equally worthless.]
[There was more along those lines, but nothing of substance. Then]:
Dave: Everything is a matter of opinion. It is not my opinion that you cited it--that is a fact.
[Blogger: This is where Jason called on Steve Zielinski, who had nothing to say this evening.]
Then there was a motion to pay the bills, and your faithful blogger, prompted by John Festa,
made a flamboyant remark and then things got really exciting and noisy for a couple of minutes.
Here it is, with a little background.
John Festa sat looking at me with his face arranged into something that looked like a smile that said, "I have the power, and I am going to rub your nose in it."
I assumed an expression that pulled up the corners of my mouth, showed my teeth, and squinted my eyes.
John Festa: You look much nicer when you smile.
CP: That was not a smile--it was a grimace, because you look like a jack o' lantern.
Jason, having ignored yawns, "bullshit," and "Jesus Christ" from the back of the room, sprang into action and asked if I wanted him to call the sheriff to remove me, reciting the number from memory. We wrangled for a couple of sentences, with Jason reiterating the threat.
CP: No, I don't want to go. But I want you to deal with people more or less objectively and consistently. We were being harassed from the back of the room as usual, and you ignore it.
Jason: We are here to conduct township business. That is our only purpose.
[Well, what gets pounced on and what gets ignored contradict that self-righteous statement. Now, having said that, I should have just contented myself with my grimace and let John Festa's remark fall into a well of silence.]
Thursday, October 30, 2014
Trustees Oct. 16, 2014: More Public Comment
Cal Brant: What about the inside color of the door?
John Festa: The same thing as the wall color?
Cal: All the time I have spent here, about 8 weeks: the accidents that have occurred here--it is the stupidity of the people who won't wait. There is a guy in a pickup truck that I swear waits for someone to come and then he guns it. People pull out in front of traffic because they are too impatient. The other day I almost set the lift down on someone who was cutting through this area.
[Blogger: There was a question about the door handle on the new door, but I did not hear the answer.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: In light of the accident that occurred over here a few weeks ago, and by the way if you have any spare traffic cones in the garage it might not be a bad idea to put 3 or 4 across there [the driveway at the Township Hall while work is being done.]
I was at the corners with the tractor [hauling hay] and there was a guy in the left turn lane who passed me from the left turn lane in the intersection. But if you put up traffic lights at every intersection in this township, you will not have a rural township. It would be better to have people lobby the state.
What signs are we getting for this grant?
Jason: Stop signs, arrow signs, different varieties. Speed limit signs. They will replace existing signs. They will be high reflectivity signs.
Dave: We need a good half dozen that say Dangerous Intersection.
Jason: They are available. But this was done way back.
Dave: I brought this up back when it was first mentioned. This is a safety issue and the trustees are charged with the safety of the residents.
Jason: We can still get them. [Blogger note: If you remember, not enough money had been allocated for the signs, and it had to be moved from other places.]
Dave: That doesn't enhance the safety. [Blogger: This is what my notes say. I will check the recording to see if anything didn't make it into the notes, or whether context will make it possible to insert clarification.]
Note: At this point, Larry Leitzow or someone who sounds like him muttered audibly, "Jesus Christ."
Dave: A new stop sign is still just a stop sign.
There was some debate and discussion about this.
Dave: Did you read Judith Sutherland's column in Farm and Dairy today? Her column today was about responsible leadership. You cited an attorney's opinion that the zoning book could not be defended in a court of law--that attorney was not the township's counsel. That was smoke and mirrors. [Blogger: I believe that the smoke and mirrors referred more to Jason's remark than to the attorney's--another of many attempts to take refuge behind some semblance of authority, rather than taking an accountable stand.]
Jason: If you want to put me on the spot for mentioning someone's opinion--
[At this point, Dave and Jason both began talking over each other, which is impossible to get on the spot in notes. I will listen and see if I can capture some if not all of that exchange, which ended with Jason simply calling on Steve Zielinski. But it won't be right now. I am very grateful for having three weeks between meetings this month and will finish up within a day or so.]
John Festa: The same thing as the wall color?
Cal: All the time I have spent here, about 8 weeks: the accidents that have occurred here--it is the stupidity of the people who won't wait. There is a guy in a pickup truck that I swear waits for someone to come and then he guns it. People pull out in front of traffic because they are too impatient. The other day I almost set the lift down on someone who was cutting through this area.
[Blogger: There was a question about the door handle on the new door, but I did not hear the answer.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: In light of the accident that occurred over here a few weeks ago, and by the way if you have any spare traffic cones in the garage it might not be a bad idea to put 3 or 4 across there [the driveway at the Township Hall while work is being done.]
I was at the corners with the tractor [hauling hay] and there was a guy in the left turn lane who passed me from the left turn lane in the intersection. But if you put up traffic lights at every intersection in this township, you will not have a rural township. It would be better to have people lobby the state.
What signs are we getting for this grant?
Jason: Stop signs, arrow signs, different varieties. Speed limit signs. They will replace existing signs. They will be high reflectivity signs.
Dave: We need a good half dozen that say Dangerous Intersection.
Jason: They are available. But this was done way back.
Dave: I brought this up back when it was first mentioned. This is a safety issue and the trustees are charged with the safety of the residents.
Jason: We can still get them. [Blogger note: If you remember, not enough money had been allocated for the signs, and it had to be moved from other places.]
Dave: That doesn't enhance the safety. [Blogger: This is what my notes say. I will check the recording to see if anything didn't make it into the notes, or whether context will make it possible to insert clarification.]
Note: At this point, Larry Leitzow or someone who sounds like him muttered audibly, "Jesus Christ."
Dave: A new stop sign is still just a stop sign.
There was some debate and discussion about this.
Dave: Did you read Judith Sutherland's column in Farm and Dairy today? Her column today was about responsible leadership. You cited an attorney's opinion that the zoning book could not be defended in a court of law--that attorney was not the township's counsel. That was smoke and mirrors. [Blogger: I believe that the smoke and mirrors referred more to Jason's remark than to the attorney's--another of many attempts to take refuge behind some semblance of authority, rather than taking an accountable stand.]
Jason: If you want to put me on the spot for mentioning someone's opinion--
[At this point, Dave and Jason both began talking over each other, which is impossible to get on the spot in notes. I will listen and see if I can capture some if not all of that exchange, which ended with Jason simply calling on Steve Zielinski. But it won't be right now. I am very grateful for having three weeks between meetings this month and will finish up within a day or so.]
Tuesday, October 28, 2014
Trustees, 10-16-14: Public Comment: ZI's Attitude, more
Public Comment: Mark Hall was called upon first and had no comment.
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: I would like for you to bear with me on what I am going to say. There is a precedent for this on the part of a resident some months ago. Because of the content of the remarks and general tenor of things about the situation with zoning right now, when I did my blog [about the October 2 meeting] I did not rely just upon my notes but listened to a recording. What that means is starting and stopping several times to make sure it is/was accurate.
I think that what was put in quotes in the minutes is not 100% accurate. That is not a criticism because it is nearly impossible writing in longhand [as Marie does to take the minutes] to get a verbatim account. This is what was objectionable. This is exactly what was said: [The speaker was Dave Pollard at the October 2 meeting.] "I was more upset probably than she was [that was Terri] about the attitude your zoning inspector brought to the job. I believe it is inexcusable for a government [elected?] official in this country to take that attitude.
[At that point Jason questioned me about where this was going. I had not been aware of it during that meeting, but afterwards was told that John Festa did something to urge Jason to challenge me on my remarks. On the recording, I could hear something that apparently was John Festa objecting, but focusing on my comments at the time meant that I did not notice those noises.]
Pollard, opposing Jason's challenge: Jason, I asked you please to bear with me. Far worse things have been said in this meeting and to you and about you and about all of us.
Jason: Can you say it might need to be changed.
CP: No, I want you to know what it was. [Then I resumed about elected officials]: that attitude towards people he supposedly works for. There was comment about the sacrifices in 1941-1945 so we do not have that kind of government throughout the planet that relied on fear and intimidation.
By now everyone knows that I am not a timid person. I was sitting in Marie's office last summer when Mr. Dickey appeared in the doorway and jovially informed me that I was in violation of something or other because I had not mowed the grass alongside my driveway. I can tell you what I thought right then: "Oh, so this is how it's gonna work." I felt in spite of the smiling and joviality I felt threatened. You have heard from several people that the reason they don't come and speak up is because they are afraid. I can assure you that if I felt threatened, I suspect that people who got violation letters felt much more threatened.
You have had a number of comments about the I guess stubbornness on the part of the zoning inspector not listening. The job of supervisors is simultaneously to support and to advise the people working under them. I did not hear much at all about anything in supervising Mr. Dickey except that maybe the form of the letter would have to be corrected. That wasn't what the problem was.
I read you verbatim what I wrote. There is a recording, not official, but a recording, of the meetings. This is once you might look at and listen to the recording because if your minutes were not 100% accurate, then they probably should be corrected.
Someone stood in the back of the room [a number of meetings ago] and demanded that the minutes be corrected because she had not been quoted correctly. I really suggest that and I suggest strongly that you consider how the person you hired to go out and meet people all over the township, how he affects them.
I was sitting over there [in a chair on the south wall, by the lectern for the correspondence] waiting for the [last] meeting to start and he walked by and kicked the leg of the chair. I did not consider that a joke even if he was laughing. That was not a friendly gesture. You should listen, and I don't think you do.
[OK, I did not demand a correction, in spite of stating that I think one was in order. John Festa has exactly the zoning inspector he wants, and in case you haven't noticed, Jason is not objecting, either. My comments on this night were a completely impromptu response to John Festa's earlier remarks about inflammatory language. When the veterans' memorial was being built, John Festa had many high-sounding, nobly pious things to say about patriotism and being a proud American. Did he think that those veterans who served, especially the ones in WWII, served to make this country safe for an overbearing buffoon? But all that rhetoric plays well for the camera, doesn't it?
[Why is this post so long? Well, I suspect that it has prompted outraged howls in other quarters, and you should see what really got said. Is it long because I get off on holding forth? Are you nuts? This thing has eaten up a solid hour.
[But this is a big issue whether it looks like it or not. It deals with the quality of life in this township, not just in regard to zoning and not the physical quality like whether the grass is cut. Far more importantly, this is how people are treated.
[People are no longer being treated humanely, but are being intimidated and badgered if they seem to have few resources. However, if they live in large houses and come to meetings obviously prosperous and well educated enough to hire lawyers if things go badly enough, they are catered to.
[Am I jealous or envious? No. More credit to anyone who has achieved all of that. But someone who lives in a house that cost $12,500 thirty or forty years ago should be treated as well as someone whose house cost $350,000. They used to be treated that way in this township. Not now.]
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: I would like for you to bear with me on what I am going to say. There is a precedent for this on the part of a resident some months ago. Because of the content of the remarks and general tenor of things about the situation with zoning right now, when I did my blog [about the October 2 meeting] I did not rely just upon my notes but listened to a recording. What that means is starting and stopping several times to make sure it is/was accurate.
I think that what was put in quotes in the minutes is not 100% accurate. That is not a criticism because it is nearly impossible writing in longhand [as Marie does to take the minutes] to get a verbatim account. This is what was objectionable. This is exactly what was said: [The speaker was Dave Pollard at the October 2 meeting.] "I was more upset probably than she was [that was Terri] about the attitude your zoning inspector brought to the job. I believe it is inexcusable for a government [elected?] official in this country to take that attitude.
[At that point Jason questioned me about where this was going. I had not been aware of it during that meeting, but afterwards was told that John Festa did something to urge Jason to challenge me on my remarks. On the recording, I could hear something that apparently was John Festa objecting, but focusing on my comments at the time meant that I did not notice those noises.]
Pollard, opposing Jason's challenge: Jason, I asked you please to bear with me. Far worse things have been said in this meeting and to you and about you and about all of us.
Jason: Can you say it might need to be changed.
CP: No, I want you to know what it was. [Then I resumed about elected officials]: that attitude towards people he supposedly works for. There was comment about the sacrifices in 1941-1945 so we do not have that kind of government throughout the planet that relied on fear and intimidation.
By now everyone knows that I am not a timid person. I was sitting in Marie's office last summer when Mr. Dickey appeared in the doorway and jovially informed me that I was in violation of something or other because I had not mowed the grass alongside my driveway. I can tell you what I thought right then: "Oh, so this is how it's gonna work." I felt in spite of the smiling and joviality I felt threatened. You have heard from several people that the reason they don't come and speak up is because they are afraid. I can assure you that if I felt threatened, I suspect that people who got violation letters felt much more threatened.
You have had a number of comments about the I guess stubbornness on the part of the zoning inspector not listening. The job of supervisors is simultaneously to support and to advise the people working under them. I did not hear much at all about anything in supervising Mr. Dickey except that maybe the form of the letter would have to be corrected. That wasn't what the problem was.
I read you verbatim what I wrote. There is a recording, not official, but a recording, of the meetings. This is once you might look at and listen to the recording because if your minutes were not 100% accurate, then they probably should be corrected.
Someone stood in the back of the room [a number of meetings ago] and demanded that the minutes be corrected because she had not been quoted correctly. I really suggest that and I suggest strongly that you consider how the person you hired to go out and meet people all over the township, how he affects them.
I was sitting over there [in a chair on the south wall, by the lectern for the correspondence] waiting for the [last] meeting to start and he walked by and kicked the leg of the chair. I did not consider that a joke even if he was laughing. That was not a friendly gesture. You should listen, and I don't think you do.
[OK, I did not demand a correction, in spite of stating that I think one was in order. John Festa has exactly the zoning inspector he wants, and in case you haven't noticed, Jason is not objecting, either. My comments on this night were a completely impromptu response to John Festa's earlier remarks about inflammatory language. When the veterans' memorial was being built, John Festa had many high-sounding, nobly pious things to say about patriotism and being a proud American. Did he think that those veterans who served, especially the ones in WWII, served to make this country safe for an overbearing buffoon? But all that rhetoric plays well for the camera, doesn't it?
[Why is this post so long? Well, I suspect that it has prompted outraged howls in other quarters, and you should see what really got said. Is it long because I get off on holding forth? Are you nuts? This thing has eaten up a solid hour.
[But this is a big issue whether it looks like it or not. It deals with the quality of life in this township, not just in regard to zoning and not the physical quality like whether the grass is cut. Far more importantly, this is how people are treated.
[People are no longer being treated humanely, but are being intimidated and badgered if they seem to have few resources. However, if they live in large houses and come to meetings obviously prosperous and well educated enough to hire lawyers if things go badly enough, they are catered to.
[Am I jealous or envious? No. More credit to anyone who has achieved all of that. But someone who lives in a house that cost $12,500 thirty or forty years ago should be treated as well as someone whose house cost $350,000. They used to be treated that way in this township. Not now.]
Sunday, October 26, 2014
Trustees 10-16-14: Township Hall Updates, other
Township Hall Updates, Cal Brant
Cal: We might have the cupola as a separate project. That might be included in the painting. We can't just caulk and paint the flat surfaces.
I have probably used 130 screws to pull things together up there. Over the last few decades caulk has been put over caulk or it has just been painted over. We are re than was anticipated. If we address this in a yearly fashion, the cost will be minimized by what I am doing right now.
I thought we would need to replace the boards out here in front, but we don't. We will have a good foundation. We need to draw everything in and tighten the structure up.
Cal also commented that all the work has not apparently damaged the wall surfaces inside.
Cal: By continuing with the repairs, it will be in good shape for a long time to come. So I appreciate you kind of giving me free rein. I am pleased with the way the cupola is pulling together.
Jason: I think you have done a really nice job on this.
Cal: I can't leave a project knowing that more can be done to make it better. That is why I have donated my time. No one else can use the lift to dig the caulk out. When I get involved in a project it is my baby. Probably in another 30 hours I will have it all wrapped up.
Continuing: It will not peel where we have been able to scrape it. I think when it is painted, my judgment is that we need to do total primer and then two finish coats, maybe next year for the second one.
John Festa: You are doing a fine job.
Larry Leitzow: Can the cupola be let go until next year?
Cal: No.
Larry: You think you can get it done in another 30 hours?
John Festa: We will follow your lead.
Jason: I want to publicly thank Larry Leitzow and his wife Gloria for a donation of $2500 to the town hall project.
Vic: What about doing something like MaRSI does and pay part of it.
Larry: I talked to Cal outside at the last meeting and he thought some of it can be done next year, but that is bullshit. [Written as spoken.]
There was some discussion about the possibility of someone from Coon Restoration and Sealants coming the next day to check on progress.
Jason asked Larry if he had anything else, and Larry asked about how the paint would be applied and then commented on how a friend of his who is a painter thought it should be done.
Jason then commented on the speed study and the jake brake request.
Vic: Mark Kramer stopped tonight to ask if we were going to discuss it. The request should be from Mennonite to 82, not just from Pioneer Trail.
Jason asked if any of the trucking companies had been contacted about this issue; answer, probably not.
Jason: I want to protect the residents, but I want to see if there is a reason.
Vic: It saves quite a bit on brakes.
John Festa asked if we were getting more traffic because of SR 44 being closed south of the Village, and Vic thought so. He also thought that if local trucking companies were spoken to, they would be good neighbors about not using the jake brake.
Jason gave a sign grant update and then announced that the Mantua Center school use committees would meet on Wednesday 10/22 and encouraged people to come out no matter whether they had applied to be on a committee.
Larry Leitzow yawned very audibly several times while Jason was making that announcement.
Website: Vic thanked Brent Simon for putting the pictures up.
John Festa then objected to the number of pictures devoted to certain subjects. Of the 29 pictures, 13 are of cemeteries. Four are of the cannon. He thought pictures of the ball field would be good and pointed out that there was not one of the garage. [The garage is the backdrop for the photo of the road crew elsewhere on the site.]
John Festa also commented that there were no farms, nothing of Roundup Lake, and nothing of any of the developments.
Jason: We don't want to mix government with other things.
[Blogger: For all of my criticisms of Jason, he was right on the money on this one. However, I thought it was interesting that, now that Vic has taken the photos, the other two trustees are making the decisions about how to use them.]
Vic commented that he had taken a lot of pictures and would take another look at them.
Part time help was mentioned. One letter had come in, which Marie had given to the trustees. It was going to be discussed later, in executive session.
Jason reported Winchell Road. There was more flooding. He has met with Chagrin River Watershed Partners and Portage County Soil and Water. Those two entities should be able to help the owners.
While Jason was commenting on this, Larry Leitzow yawned audibly again.
Jason thanked Marie for providing copies of the zoning letters. [He said "warning." The letter clearly begins with "violation" very prominently stated.] Jason continued, saying that as a board, we ought to take a look at those. Jason thought that those letters would not be posted on the website, but would be for internal use only.
Vic: I am glad we are getting some use out of those source books--we paid money for them.
Jason will put the township letterhead and zoning office information on the letters.
Next was public comment, and I usually wait to get a recording to check against for that part of the blog.
Cal: We might have the cupola as a separate project. That might be included in the painting. We can't just caulk and paint the flat surfaces.
I have probably used 130 screws to pull things together up there. Over the last few decades caulk has been put over caulk or it has just been painted over. We are re than was anticipated. If we address this in a yearly fashion, the cost will be minimized by what I am doing right now.
I thought we would need to replace the boards out here in front, but we don't. We will have a good foundation. We need to draw everything in and tighten the structure up.
Cal also commented that all the work has not apparently damaged the wall surfaces inside.
Cal: By continuing with the repairs, it will be in good shape for a long time to come. So I appreciate you kind of giving me free rein. I am pleased with the way the cupola is pulling together.
Jason: I think you have done a really nice job on this.
Cal: I can't leave a project knowing that more can be done to make it better. That is why I have donated my time. No one else can use the lift to dig the caulk out. When I get involved in a project it is my baby. Probably in another 30 hours I will have it all wrapped up.
Continuing: It will not peel where we have been able to scrape it. I think when it is painted, my judgment is that we need to do total primer and then two finish coats, maybe next year for the second one.
John Festa: You are doing a fine job.
Larry Leitzow: Can the cupola be let go until next year?
Cal: No.
Larry: You think you can get it done in another 30 hours?
John Festa: We will follow your lead.
Jason: I want to publicly thank Larry Leitzow and his wife Gloria for a donation of $2500 to the town hall project.
Vic: What about doing something like MaRSI does and pay part of it.
Larry: I talked to Cal outside at the last meeting and he thought some of it can be done next year, but that is bullshit. [Written as spoken.]
There was some discussion about the possibility of someone from Coon Restoration and Sealants coming the next day to check on progress.
Jason asked Larry if he had anything else, and Larry asked about how the paint would be applied and then commented on how a friend of his who is a painter thought it should be done.
Jason then commented on the speed study and the jake brake request.
Vic: Mark Kramer stopped tonight to ask if we were going to discuss it. The request should be from Mennonite to 82, not just from Pioneer Trail.
Jason asked if any of the trucking companies had been contacted about this issue; answer, probably not.
Jason: I want to protect the residents, but I want to see if there is a reason.
Vic: It saves quite a bit on brakes.
John Festa asked if we were getting more traffic because of SR 44 being closed south of the Village, and Vic thought so. He also thought that if local trucking companies were spoken to, they would be good neighbors about not using the jake brake.
Jason gave a sign grant update and then announced that the Mantua Center school use committees would meet on Wednesday 10/22 and encouraged people to come out no matter whether they had applied to be on a committee.
Larry Leitzow yawned very audibly several times while Jason was making that announcement.
Website: Vic thanked Brent Simon for putting the pictures up.
John Festa then objected to the number of pictures devoted to certain subjects. Of the 29 pictures, 13 are of cemeteries. Four are of the cannon. He thought pictures of the ball field would be good and pointed out that there was not one of the garage. [The garage is the backdrop for the photo of the road crew elsewhere on the site.]
John Festa also commented that there were no farms, nothing of Roundup Lake, and nothing of any of the developments.
Jason: We don't want to mix government with other things.
[Blogger: For all of my criticisms of Jason, he was right on the money on this one. However, I thought it was interesting that, now that Vic has taken the photos, the other two trustees are making the decisions about how to use them.]
Vic commented that he had taken a lot of pictures and would take another look at them.
Part time help was mentioned. One letter had come in, which Marie had given to the trustees. It was going to be discussed later, in executive session.
Jason reported Winchell Road. There was more flooding. He has met with Chagrin River Watershed Partners and Portage County Soil and Water. Those two entities should be able to help the owners.
While Jason was commenting on this, Larry Leitzow yawned audibly again.
Jason thanked Marie for providing copies of the zoning letters. [He said "warning." The letter clearly begins with "violation" very prominently stated.] Jason continued, saying that as a board, we ought to take a look at those. Jason thought that those letters would not be posted on the website, but would be for internal use only.
Vic: I am glad we are getting some use out of those source books--we paid money for them.
Jason will put the township letterhead and zoning office information on the letters.
Next was public comment, and I usually wait to get a recording to check against for that part of the blog.
Wednesday, October 22, 2014
Trustees 10-16-14: Criticism unwanted
Blogger foreword: You may have noticed that there are fewer posts per meeting than there were for a long time. I have finally begun reviewing my notes before sitting down at the computer and have selected the most significant points rather than transcribing every word for relatively routine things. Where I think the issues raised are important, or where a comment reveals character or attitude in important ways, the blog is a transcript at least of my notes and possibly a true transcript from a recording.
Spending a half hour looking over the meeting notes saves me hours in front of the keyboard and screen, and I do not think anything truly important is being lost. Anyone who wants it all is welcome to come to a meeting, because even a video does not catch it all.
My intention--my hope?--is to do some wider or deeper investigation of issues and topics that show up in the meetings. One right now, obviously, is zoning. I understand that Deerfield Township is the poster child for what can happen if zoning is mishandled. I want to get that from someone there, not just from hearsay and reports.
For now, here is part one of the October 16, 2014, Mantua Township Trustees meeting.
It's election season, so candidates visit township meetings. On this evening, Gene Muldowney and Vicki Kline attended to introduce themselves. Vicki was there first, but Jason gave Gene Muldowney first spot.
Gene Muldowney: He is the only candidate for judge who practices law in Portage County and has been a prosecutor for 25 years. He is a graduate of Southeast High School and tried the Atwater double murders in 1995. A less noble case was the embezzlement case in Sreetsboro. Judges should be fair and impartial and know the system.
Vicki Kline is running for commissioner. She is currently the country treasurer and loves the work but thinks that she can serve more effectively as commissioner. Commissioners should have a financial background: they handle or deal with $36-38 million a year. People skills are also important. She has a CPA and CFP (Certified Financial Planner) credentials. Revenue is important, but so is being conservative. People skills are important because the commissioners are liaisons between all the departments in the county. Public officials are working for the people and should not forget that.
Steve Zielinski asked a question about the Work Force Investment act.
Vicki: That program is still not right. Transparency and accountability are very important and we lost that in that program.
Cal Brant: What do you think would be the most important project coming up?
Vicki: The land bank. We tore down drug houses and houses that were contaminated with cat feces, for example.
She also commented on the park levy: She was instrumental in passing that and is glad that it passed. Companies look at things like parks when they are looking for a place to relocate.
The candidates then left.
Club and Committee Reports: Nothing from either the Garden Club or Ladies Cemetery Association.
The Mantua Restoration Society: "MaRSI" has a spot at Derthick's Corn Maze and is providing home cooked food on a donation basis as an addition to the fair-type food from the vendors' trailers. This is a fund raising activity for the restoration society.
Chamber of Commerce, John Festa: Routine things. Shalersville is paving the parking lot, and the school sports teams are having excellent seasons. The school system is in the black.
New Business:
Jason reported on the survey on Old Frost Road. Apparently his earlier e-mail request got overlooked. The county did not have a record of a previous survey. The road crew will trim back things along the road sides to make the survey easier.
Letters for zoning and BZA expiring terms: Terri Vechery's term on zoning and Joan Martin's on the BZA are expiring. Marie is going to check to see if there is anything statutory regarding the dates of the terms. The zoning term expires on December 31 and BZA on February 28.
John Festa: The video camera was set up and running experimentally. He found one refurbished for about $249. The camera can be operated from a smart phone. Once it is mounted, anyone on the committees could enter the password into a smart phone and download the recording onto a card.
Question: How will we store the digital content?
Marie asked about putting it onto the website.
John Festa: He did not actually answer that on the spot, but commented that we need a disclaimer on usage.
Jason suggested following the procedure used by the school board.
Then what followed was discussion among Jason, John Festa, and Brent Simon about the size of the fields and storage.
Marie: If it was on the website, it can be downloaded if someone wanted copies.
John Festa was concerned about someone altering the content and said that was what the disclaimer on usage was about.
Continuing: One more thing. We put a statement in the minutes that was made by an individual last week about the zoning inspector: "The zoning inspector had an attitude of fear and intimidation."
We had an issue a few meetings back when the same individual accused us of crimes. This is inflammatory speech that should not be allowed. I don't know how [to stop it unless we cancel public comment.]
[Blogger: The brackets above are because I shifted my attention and remember the general content of the rest of John Festa's sentence but did not get the exact wording.
The comments referred to were made by Dave Pollard, who came in just as John Festa was reaching the end of his statement.
I addressed the issue of the minutes and the situation that prompted the comments that offended John Festa in public comment and will have further comment of my own in that part of the blog.]
Vic commented about the salt for the winter.
Vic: Cemetery: Vic passed out a summary of the prices and practices of surrounding townships.
Larry Leitzow or someone with a voice like his, but certainly from that corner, was muttering audibly to someone while this discussion was going on.
Vic, continuing: What he passed out contained an analysis of the segmented items and ideas that had been put together by the cemetery committee, some from other townships and some from the ORC. I (Vic) looked at other townships' websites and tried to put them together so we can compare with what was proposed. I went through the ORC and surrounding townships. This gives an idea of where we are. Currently we are at the top end for our charges. [Blogger's emphasis. The new fee structure was proposed because there had been no change in fees for several years, and--I believe--there was a concern about whether we were losing money on the cemetery fees. Remember that one of the committee members owns a funeral home.]
Jason asked if Vic had given a copy to Jim Aldrich. He had not but could.
Next came Township Hall updates, which will begin the next post.
Spending a half hour looking over the meeting notes saves me hours in front of the keyboard and screen, and I do not think anything truly important is being lost. Anyone who wants it all is welcome to come to a meeting, because even a video does not catch it all.
My intention--my hope?--is to do some wider or deeper investigation of issues and topics that show up in the meetings. One right now, obviously, is zoning. I understand that Deerfield Township is the poster child for what can happen if zoning is mishandled. I want to get that from someone there, not just from hearsay and reports.
For now, here is part one of the October 16, 2014, Mantua Township Trustees meeting.
It's election season, so candidates visit township meetings. On this evening, Gene Muldowney and Vicki Kline attended to introduce themselves. Vicki was there first, but Jason gave Gene Muldowney first spot.
Gene Muldowney: He is the only candidate for judge who practices law in Portage County and has been a prosecutor for 25 years. He is a graduate of Southeast High School and tried the Atwater double murders in 1995. A less noble case was the embezzlement case in Sreetsboro. Judges should be fair and impartial and know the system.
Vicki Kline is running for commissioner. She is currently the country treasurer and loves the work but thinks that she can serve more effectively as commissioner. Commissioners should have a financial background: they handle or deal with $36-38 million a year. People skills are also important. She has a CPA and CFP (Certified Financial Planner) credentials. Revenue is important, but so is being conservative. People skills are important because the commissioners are liaisons between all the departments in the county. Public officials are working for the people and should not forget that.
Steve Zielinski asked a question about the Work Force Investment act.
Vicki: That program is still not right. Transparency and accountability are very important and we lost that in that program.
Cal Brant: What do you think would be the most important project coming up?
Vicki: The land bank. We tore down drug houses and houses that were contaminated with cat feces, for example.
She also commented on the park levy: She was instrumental in passing that and is glad that it passed. Companies look at things like parks when they are looking for a place to relocate.
The candidates then left.
Club and Committee Reports: Nothing from either the Garden Club or Ladies Cemetery Association.
The Mantua Restoration Society: "MaRSI" has a spot at Derthick's Corn Maze and is providing home cooked food on a donation basis as an addition to the fair-type food from the vendors' trailers. This is a fund raising activity for the restoration society.
Chamber of Commerce, John Festa: Routine things. Shalersville is paving the parking lot, and the school sports teams are having excellent seasons. The school system is in the black.
New Business:
Jason reported on the survey on Old Frost Road. Apparently his earlier e-mail request got overlooked. The county did not have a record of a previous survey. The road crew will trim back things along the road sides to make the survey easier.
Letters for zoning and BZA expiring terms: Terri Vechery's term on zoning and Joan Martin's on the BZA are expiring. Marie is going to check to see if there is anything statutory regarding the dates of the terms. The zoning term expires on December 31 and BZA on February 28.
John Festa: The video camera was set up and running experimentally. He found one refurbished for about $249. The camera can be operated from a smart phone. Once it is mounted, anyone on the committees could enter the password into a smart phone and download the recording onto a card.
Question: How will we store the digital content?
Marie asked about putting it onto the website.
John Festa: He did not actually answer that on the spot, but commented that we need a disclaimer on usage.
Jason suggested following the procedure used by the school board.
Then what followed was discussion among Jason, John Festa, and Brent Simon about the size of the fields and storage.
Marie: If it was on the website, it can be downloaded if someone wanted copies.
John Festa was concerned about someone altering the content and said that was what the disclaimer on usage was about.
Continuing: One more thing. We put a statement in the minutes that was made by an individual last week about the zoning inspector: "The zoning inspector had an attitude of fear and intimidation."
We had an issue a few meetings back when the same individual accused us of crimes. This is inflammatory speech that should not be allowed. I don't know how [to stop it unless we cancel public comment.]
[Blogger: The brackets above are because I shifted my attention and remember the general content of the rest of John Festa's sentence but did not get the exact wording.
The comments referred to were made by Dave Pollard, who came in just as John Festa was reaching the end of his statement.
I addressed the issue of the minutes and the situation that prompted the comments that offended John Festa in public comment and will have further comment of my own in that part of the blog.]
Vic commented about the salt for the winter.
Vic: Cemetery: Vic passed out a summary of the prices and practices of surrounding townships.
Larry Leitzow or someone with a voice like his, but certainly from that corner, was muttering audibly to someone while this discussion was going on.
Vic, continuing: What he passed out contained an analysis of the segmented items and ideas that had been put together by the cemetery committee, some from other townships and some from the ORC. I (Vic) looked at other townships' websites and tried to put them together so we can compare with what was proposed. I went through the ORC and surrounding townships. This gives an idea of where we are. Currently we are at the top end for our charges. [Blogger's emphasis. The new fee structure was proposed because there had been no change in fees for several years, and--I believe--there was a concern about whether we were losing money on the cemetery fees. Remember that one of the committee members owns a funeral home.]
Jason asked if Vic had given a copy to Jim Aldrich. He had not but could.
Next came Township Hall updates, which will begin the next post.
Monday, October 13, 2014
Details, Comments re Zoning, last post
Blogger Foreword: In the previous post, I promised to check Dave Pollard's comments about zoning in reference to the September 11 Zoning Commission meeting that prompted Jason at the September 18 trustees meeting (a) to announce that the trustees meeting was not a Bash John session and (b) to proceed to bash Terri Vechery.
My reason for checking is that I cannot keep up with even moderately paced speaking, and I thought Dave's remarks needed to be presented as accurately as possible. Checking my notes against the recording--actually, it's a matter of starting the recording, smoking the pen across the page, and then stopping and re-starting when I fall behind and then repeating until it's all on paper--is very time consuming. I have done it often enough to feel confident that the import of my notes is accurate, even though not verbatim. Dave's remarks on October 2 deserved that attention and detail.
The lurkers on the rogue website claim that my blog is not accurate because it is not complete, so people should watch the video. Yes. You should. You should see what the voters thought would be an improvement over Mark Hall as a trustee, which is what made this fiasco possible by installing two trustees who pay a lot more attention to their "advisers" than to the voters and residents whom they are supposed to be serving. No matter what I tell you about the meetings, you really need to see and hear--visuals and tone tell volumes--what the two junior trustees are doing to the township. And ask yourself who is really being served--never mind the pious remarks.
The rogue website was put up as much as anything to show the then trustees--Vic Grimm and Mark Hall--in as bad a light as possible. A number of meetings were carefully orchestrated so that public comment did exactly that. Now, however, all that is necessary is to show exactly what is going on. The junior trustees don't need any staging to show up in a bad light. They have it nailed, with no coaching. You should watch.
OK. Now to a detailed report of Dave Pollard's remarks about the current state of affairs in zoning as he gave them on October 2.
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: I want to revisit a few remarks that were made at the last meeting. One was that whenever we try to do something nice, people try to put a stop to it. At the last meeting no one said anything about getting rid of the zoning inspector or zoning--it was about doing things improperly.
The term "unprofessional" was used. I was at that meeting. Mrs. Vechery was not unprofessional in her remarks. She was responding to the unprofessional behavior of your zoning inspector. I did not hear her being rude. She was upset.
I was probably more upset than she was about the attitude your zoning inspector brought to the job. I believe it is inexcusable for a government official in this [Dave's emphasis] country to take that attitude towards the people he supposedly works for.
About the gun and kids climbing on it. They have done that from the beginning, and no one has ever gotten hurt.
That gun is a monument to the men and women who put aside everything from 1941-1945 to make sure that government by fear and intimidation is not the type of government that reigns on the whole planet. But that is the attitude that your zoning inspector has brought in. That is what people are protesting. [Blogger's emphasis--with a deep understanding of how important this point is to Dave.]
To say that he is going by the book is totally out of touch. You've got enough examples in front of you that you should know that. Those are the kinds of things that need to be revisited. It was your zoning inspector's repeated behavior and disregard for the book that started this. If you correct those things, it will reflect well on you. But if you let it go, that is what people will remember.
My reason for checking is that I cannot keep up with even moderately paced speaking, and I thought Dave's remarks needed to be presented as accurately as possible. Checking my notes against the recording--actually, it's a matter of starting the recording, smoking the pen across the page, and then stopping and re-starting when I fall behind and then repeating until it's all on paper--is very time consuming. I have done it often enough to feel confident that the import of my notes is accurate, even though not verbatim. Dave's remarks on October 2 deserved that attention and detail.
The lurkers on the rogue website claim that my blog is not accurate because it is not complete, so people should watch the video. Yes. You should. You should see what the voters thought would be an improvement over Mark Hall as a trustee, which is what made this fiasco possible by installing two trustees who pay a lot more attention to their "advisers" than to the voters and residents whom they are supposed to be serving. No matter what I tell you about the meetings, you really need to see and hear--visuals and tone tell volumes--what the two junior trustees are doing to the township. And ask yourself who is really being served--never mind the pious remarks.
The rogue website was put up as much as anything to show the then trustees--Vic Grimm and Mark Hall--in as bad a light as possible. A number of meetings were carefully orchestrated so that public comment did exactly that. Now, however, all that is necessary is to show exactly what is going on. The junior trustees don't need any staging to show up in a bad light. They have it nailed, with no coaching. You should watch.
OK. Now to a detailed report of Dave Pollard's remarks about the current state of affairs in zoning as he gave them on October 2.
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: I want to revisit a few remarks that were made at the last meeting. One was that whenever we try to do something nice, people try to put a stop to it. At the last meeting no one said anything about getting rid of the zoning inspector or zoning--it was about doing things improperly.
The term "unprofessional" was used. I was at that meeting. Mrs. Vechery was not unprofessional in her remarks. She was responding to the unprofessional behavior of your zoning inspector. I did not hear her being rude. She was upset.
I was probably more upset than she was about the attitude your zoning inspector brought to the job. I believe it is inexcusable for a government official in this [Dave's emphasis] country to take that attitude towards the people he supposedly works for.
About the gun and kids climbing on it. They have done that from the beginning, and no one has ever gotten hurt.
That gun is a monument to the men and women who put aside everything from 1941-1945 to make sure that government by fear and intimidation is not the type of government that reigns on the whole planet. But that is the attitude that your zoning inspector has brought in. That is what people are protesting. [Blogger's emphasis--with a deep understanding of how important this point is to Dave.]
To say that he is going by the book is totally out of touch. You've got enough examples in front of you that you should know that. Those are the kinds of things that need to be revisited. It was your zoning inspector's repeated behavior and disregard for the book that started this. If you correct those things, it will reflect well on you. But if you let it go, that is what people will remember.
Saturday, October 11, 2014
Public Comment 10-2-14; Blunt clarification, Zoning Meeting.
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: I commented on the discovery during the Garden Club work day in the bull pen that a car had missed the turn coming down Diagonal to the stop sign at Center Road and had damaged the mailbox, the phone/light pole guy wire, and two small trees. If there is no sign warning of a curve, there probably should be. [Note: I checked a couple of days ago: There is a straight arrow and the stop sign symbol, the standard warning of a stop sign ahead. But the arrow is straight. If someone is not familiar with the road, the arrow suggests that it is straight. Oops!]
Sue Skrovan, Wayne Road: On Saturday the Garden Club worked in the bullpen. Shirley Ferris, Martha Levine and her two small children, Sue, and Terri Vechery came to work, and Carole Pollard showed up to volunteer. We cleaned up and planted mums. We are still fighting with the weeds growing in the mulch. We think part of the problem is the patch of thistle between the 12-holer and the Township Hall--the seeds blow into the bull pen. We did a lot of trimming and cleaning.
Lynn Harvey: The topic of forms that we were talking about earlier: This book I was referring to has all kinds of forms that the BZA and others can use. If you are going to be designing any forms, I would recommend these.
Also, where Diagonal and Frost Road intersect, there have been a lot of crashes there. They have just paved that area, and I don't know who did it, but some very large stop signs have been put up. Those are both county roads, and I don't know if they would be appropriate, but maybe you could get them here.
Vic commented that very few stop signs are under the control of a township.
Lynn: I think the little [flashing?] lights are a good idea and some of the posts have bright red fluorescent strips on them
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: I want to revisit a few remarks made at the last meeting. One was that whenever you try to do something nice, people try to put a stop to it. No one said anything about doing away with zoning or firing the Zoning Inspector.
The term "unprofessional behavior" was used. I was at that [zoning] meeting. Terri Vechery was not unprofessional. She was responding to the unprofessional behavior of your zoning inspector. She was upset but I did not hear her being upset. I was, because I was even more upset than she was about how he [Zoning Inspector John Dickey] is behaving. I think it is unacceptable for someone in this country to behave that way. [Blogger: I think there was a bit more to these remarks. I am done for the moment, but I will check the recording and add whatever may be missing or correct whatever is not exactly what was said here.]
That gun [relevant to Frank Horack's comment about kids playing on the cannon] is a monument to the people who put everything aside so that we would not be governed by feat or intimidation. It was your zoning inspector's behavior that has people upset. If you let him go, that is what people will remember.
Steve Zelinsky, S.R. 82: Steve thanked Marie Stehli for her donation to the veterans' memorial. Maybe we can raise enough money to put up some posts and a chain so people don't do that. And maybe around the pump.
Sue Skrovan, Wayne Road: On Saturday the Garden Club worked in the bullpen. Shirley Ferris, Martha Levine and her two small children, Sue, and Terri Vechery came to work, and Carole Pollard showed up to volunteer. We cleaned up and planted mums. We are still fighting with the weeds growing in the mulch. We think part of the problem is the patch of thistle between the 12-holer and the Township Hall--the seeds blow into the bull pen. We did a lot of trimming and cleaning.
Lynn Harvey: The topic of forms that we were talking about earlier: This book I was referring to has all kinds of forms that the BZA and others can use. If you are going to be designing any forms, I would recommend these.
Also, where Diagonal and Frost Road intersect, there have been a lot of crashes there. They have just paved that area, and I don't know who did it, but some very large stop signs have been put up. Those are both county roads, and I don't know if they would be appropriate, but maybe you could get them here.
Vic commented that very few stop signs are under the control of a township.
Lynn: I think the little [flashing?] lights are a good idea and some of the posts have bright red fluorescent strips on them
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: I want to revisit a few remarks made at the last meeting. One was that whenever you try to do something nice, people try to put a stop to it. No one said anything about doing away with zoning or firing the Zoning Inspector.
The term "unprofessional behavior" was used. I was at that [zoning] meeting. Terri Vechery was not unprofessional. She was responding to the unprofessional behavior of your zoning inspector. She was upset but I did not hear her being upset. I was, because I was even more upset than she was about how he [Zoning Inspector John Dickey] is behaving. I think it is unacceptable for someone in this country to behave that way. [Blogger: I think there was a bit more to these remarks. I am done for the moment, but I will check the recording and add whatever may be missing or correct whatever is not exactly what was said here.]
That gun [relevant to Frank Horack's comment about kids playing on the cannon] is a monument to the people who put everything aside so that we would not be governed by feat or intimidation. It was your zoning inspector's behavior that has people upset. If you let him go, that is what people will remember.
Steve Zelinsky, S.R. 82: Steve thanked Marie Stehli for her donation to the veterans' memorial. Maybe we can raise enough money to put up some posts and a chain so people don't do that. And maybe around the pump.
Trustees 10-2-14: Township Hall, other updates
Cal Brant: The back end of the building is pretty well taken care of and the renailing. I am making up the wraps for the sills now and the flashing on the headers. Saturday will be a workday again. I am hoping to hear from Steve Coon as to when they will be able to paint.
Vic: I will call him tomorrow morning. When do you figure that you will be ready?
Cal: Next week. I have a few more short pieces to cut out.
Cal thanked John Festa, Sue Skrovan, Noah Bowers, Carole Pollard, and Ellen Monroe for helping.
Marie: Cal has given us a list of what he has done and has given me a bill for $1400 more than we set aside to pay. I need permission to pay that.
Jason: We did not know what it was going to cost with volunteers; we are now to the point that we should allocate additional dollars.
Jason raised a question about final figures from the Township Cleanup. Marie has encumbered what she thinks we will need for the end of the year. Part of it is $800 for the camera and electrical work. There is a tax collection fees fund that has some money in it.
Jason: What do we need to pay those two bills?
Marie: I have $ 1490 worth of bills that we can not pay at this point.
Cal: John Fest a and I talked yesterday and I would be willing to defer [payment for] the work I did until next year.
There was some discussion about all of this, and finally Jason asked about moving $3,000. Marie said she thought $4,000 from tax collection fees to improvement of sites, Town Hall. Jason made the motion, seconded by Vic. Passed.
Cal commented that the work being done by volunteers is not glamorous, but it helps out. He also said that he wanted to be able to show what the original estimate/original contract was and what ended up being extra for needed repairs.
After that, there was an update on the signs. The purchase orders have begun coming in. All of the posts and hardware for the township signs have come in.
Marie asked about paperwork from the state about signing off.
John Festa reported about the newsletter and recording meetings. He has had conversations with Dave Toth, Crestwood School superintendent, about those topics. A sample newsletter for the high school principal to look at would be helpful.
Jason asked Vic about the website. The pictures are there. Brent had taken a few and posted them as well.
Applications for part time help should go to Marie.
More meetings between Chagrin River Watershed Partners and Portage County Soil and Water are in the offing.
Another salt supplier has been found at a price of $105 per ton. Vic commented that we have been accepted into the queue.
Both Vic and Jake had more on the request for a No Jake Brake sign from the last meeting.
Vic commented that two accidents had occurred in the last three weeks at Center Road and Rt.82; a study has to be done. A couple of people who have been in touch with Vic were willing to get up a petition if that is what it will take. He also mentioned a little about the history of trying to get lights there.
Jason said he was curious about who was at fault and why they didn't see the signs.
Dave Pollard (some audience comment had been encouraged): There is a real visibility issue around the equinoxes. The sun is directly in line with S.R. 82 then. But it is not a matter of not seeing the signs--it is a matter of ignoring them. There is no driver education any more, and I have seen people pass in an intersection on a double yellow line or on this grade coming to the intersection [here]. The lighted signs are probably the best thing you could do.
Faith Osborn commented that it is a very busy intersection. She thought that someday someone would be killed there. [In fact, someone has been killed there.]
Dave: Also the extra traffic from S.R. 44 being closed.
Carole Pollard said that the huge maple tree's shade makes it difficult to see cars on the north side of S.R. 82 at the intersection.
Marie thought maybe a Dangerous Intersection sign might help, and Mark Hall suggested contacting the sheriff's office to get someone out to write citations.
Vic commented that the deputies do sit here and write tickets a lot.
Vic: I will call him tomorrow morning. When do you figure that you will be ready?
Cal: Next week. I have a few more short pieces to cut out.
Cal thanked John Festa, Sue Skrovan, Noah Bowers, Carole Pollard, and Ellen Monroe for helping.
Marie: Cal has given us a list of what he has done and has given me a bill for $1400 more than we set aside to pay. I need permission to pay that.
Jason: We did not know what it was going to cost with volunteers; we are now to the point that we should allocate additional dollars.
Jason raised a question about final figures from the Township Cleanup. Marie has encumbered what she thinks we will need for the end of the year. Part of it is $800 for the camera and electrical work. There is a tax collection fees fund that has some money in it.
Jason: What do we need to pay those two bills?
Marie: I have $ 1490 worth of bills that we can not pay at this point.
Cal: John Fest a and I talked yesterday and I would be willing to defer [payment for] the work I did until next year.
There was some discussion about all of this, and finally Jason asked about moving $3,000. Marie said she thought $4,000 from tax collection fees to improvement of sites, Town Hall. Jason made the motion, seconded by Vic. Passed.
Cal commented that the work being done by volunteers is not glamorous, but it helps out. He also said that he wanted to be able to show what the original estimate/original contract was and what ended up being extra for needed repairs.
After that, there was an update on the signs. The purchase orders have begun coming in. All of the posts and hardware for the township signs have come in.
Marie asked about paperwork from the state about signing off.
John Festa reported about the newsletter and recording meetings. He has had conversations with Dave Toth, Crestwood School superintendent, about those topics. A sample newsletter for the high school principal to look at would be helpful.
Jason asked Vic about the website. The pictures are there. Brent had taken a few and posted them as well.
Applications for part time help should go to Marie.
More meetings between Chagrin River Watershed Partners and Portage County Soil and Water are in the offing.
Another salt supplier has been found at a price of $105 per ton. Vic commented that we have been accepted into the queue.
Both Vic and Jake had more on the request for a No Jake Brake sign from the last meeting.
Vic commented that two accidents had occurred in the last three weeks at Center Road and Rt.82; a study has to be done. A couple of people who have been in touch with Vic were willing to get up a petition if that is what it will take. He also mentioned a little about the history of trying to get lights there.
Jason said he was curious about who was at fault and why they didn't see the signs.
Dave Pollard (some audience comment had been encouraged): There is a real visibility issue around the equinoxes. The sun is directly in line with S.R. 82 then. But it is not a matter of not seeing the signs--it is a matter of ignoring them. There is no driver education any more, and I have seen people pass in an intersection on a double yellow line or on this grade coming to the intersection [here]. The lighted signs are probably the best thing you could do.
Faith Osborn commented that it is a very busy intersection. She thought that someday someone would be killed there. [In fact, someone has been killed there.]
Dave: Also the extra traffic from S.R. 44 being closed.
Carole Pollard said that the huge maple tree's shade makes it difficult to see cars on the north side of S.R. 82 at the intersection.
Marie thought maybe a Dangerous Intersection sign might help, and Mark Hall suggested contacting the sheriff's office to get someone out to write citations.
Vic commented that the deputies do sit here and write tickets a lot.
Thursday, October 9, 2014
Mantua Twp. Trustees 10-2-14
Foreword: As indicated in the previous post, the proceedings before Todd Peetz spoke were fairly routine, except that Marie requested a motion to increase the budget by an additional $848.00 [plus or minus a little] to cover the cost of the signs in the sign grant. That was done.
The zoning inspector's report followed Todd. It was fairly routine, but there is a case pending with PJC that the prosecutor is holding open.
Marie asked John Dickey not to leave because he had to sign his bond. John Dickey came up to the table and signed so that he did not have to stay for the whole meeting.
Lynn Harvey, Zoning Commission chairperson, reported that there will be two public hearings on October 16: One at 7 p.m. and one at 7:30. One is to fix some typos and section reference errors.
The big public hearing is for 7:30 to consider an application from Gary Carlton requesting a zoning text amendment for the Light Restricted Manufacturing (LRM) area where his mulching operation is. The application includes disregarding the restrictions on outdoor storage.
Once there is a decision, the paperwork will go to the trustees to make their decision.
Cemetery Reports, Jim Aldrich: Burial fees, $200; Foundation fees, $425; Grave Sales, $700. Jim gave the trustees a rewrite of the cemetery rules and new pricing that the cemetery committee had worked out. One change would be to use a square footage fee price because we appeared to be losing money on the foundations. Jim said he will get more information on that. The price increase for the grave sites would be more in line with other communities; our prices have not changed for about 6 years.
Vic to Jim Aldrich: I have been working on the square footage price and we are at the upper end of pricing for most communities.
The roads report was fairly routine.
Veterans' Memorial, Frank Horack: The flags have been ordered and it is hoped that they will be installed by 3 weeks from now.
Also: There was a large clambake [The Ruritans, of which your blogger believes Frank is a member]on Sunday and it was reported that some kids were climbing on the plumbing of the pump and also on the cannon. Something should probably be done.
After that, Frank Horack, Jim Aldrich, and Brian Tayerle left. Larry Leitzow went out at the same time.
Discussion about speed limit signs on Skinner and Sheldon south of Rt. 82 followed: The limit declared by ODOT is 40mph on both.
Cal Brant asked what the legal speed is on our roads. Answer: Unless posted, it is 55mph.
Cal: I brought it up because Wayne Road is a shortcut between 82 and 44. People are traveling more than 55mph, and kids are riding bicycles and people are walking dogs, posing a problem.
Vic: We need to have a resolution. It has been a long time since we did this.
Jason: About zoning--the letter being used that was discussed last meeting is no longer being sent out.
Vic called attention to Lynn Harvey, who asked if she could comment.
Lynn: I was looking through the Ohio Zoning Source Book. I don't know whether John Dickey has this. To John Dickey: Does this look familiar?
John Dickey: No.
Lynn went to the table and gave a sample warning letter and one other to them, saying, I thought that might be something you might want to adopt.
Jason: Do you have a copy you can give to John Dickey?
Lynn: I would think he would have it. [Tools of the trade, after all--blogger.]
Vic: I think it came as a set. There are various subjects in the set.
Marie commented that it could be copied into the copier and saved so it could be printed off for anyone who wanted it.
Next was an issue about a property at the corner of Saint Joseph Boulevard and Pioneer Trail. The owners want to sell the house, and the issue is that the new EPA and septic regulations require that on transfer, if anyone has a system not in compliance (considered an illicit discharge0, the EPA is regulating that anyone within 400 feet of a sewer line must tie in. Other than that, there are few options.
The property is within 400 feet.
The owners were at the meeting and the wife commented that everyone seems to be aware of this, but are not doing anything because they are not planning on selling. The remedies so far look like a nightmare to tie into St. Joseph's line. The other option is to bore under the road and tie in there. The purchasers have a locked-in interest rate that they are anxious to keep.
Jason asked if anyone had a problem with boring under the road, and Vic asked some technical questions. There was some indecision about what to do, depending on the size of the line an other technical issues.
Vic: If boring is done under the road by a qualified contractor and one of our representatives is there, [that would be acceptable]. It is up to the seller.
Jason said he would talk to the right people the next day so everyone knows what is going on.
Cal Brant mentioned a mini sewage plant that is being manufactured in Cleveland and is EPA approved.
Old Business came next. There was some discussion about Halloween and keeping it in sync with the Village, which has moved Trick or Treat to October 30 from 5:30 - 7:30 to avoid a conflict with a home football game. A motion was made to follow suit, seconded and passed.
There was some discussion with Brent Simon about putting that information on the township website, as well as information about the flu clinic [already past as the blog is being done].
Vic: I had a couple of questions about the zoning. To John Dickey: Are you still using the agricultural paperwork that you had?
John Dickey: Same as we have been using all along. John Vechery had been using it.
Vic: I am talking about the one that was brought to a meeting.
Then there was a question about a BZA modification to a form.
John Dickey: They just put everything on one ____[Blogger: missed the word.]
Vic: The one I got did not have a notation about when he had signed off.
[Blogger: I believe John Dickey expressed some confusion about this. I have two question marks after his name in my notes at this point.]
Vic: We need dates on those things.
John Dickey: I don't know what you are talking about. I gave them one packet and they lost it and I had to get another one for them. [Blogger: I have heard two stories about this now. One is that John Dickey gave the packet to Betsy Woolf, who is the BZA secretary, to give to the BZA and that she lost it--with which I believe she took issue. The other is the version here. Either way, John Dickey's position is that someone else is at fault.]
Vic: Then that new form is already on the website? So we can pull it off of there.
John Dickey: Yes.
Vic stated then that was all he had under old business.
[Blogger: The next item is updates on the Township Hall, but I want to begin the next post with that instead of sticking it at the end of this one. So--done for this session.] .
The zoning inspector's report followed Todd. It was fairly routine, but there is a case pending with PJC that the prosecutor is holding open.
Marie asked John Dickey not to leave because he had to sign his bond. John Dickey came up to the table and signed so that he did not have to stay for the whole meeting.
Lynn Harvey, Zoning Commission chairperson, reported that there will be two public hearings on October 16: One at 7 p.m. and one at 7:30. One is to fix some typos and section reference errors.
The big public hearing is for 7:30 to consider an application from Gary Carlton requesting a zoning text amendment for the Light Restricted Manufacturing (LRM) area where his mulching operation is. The application includes disregarding the restrictions on outdoor storage.
Once there is a decision, the paperwork will go to the trustees to make their decision.
Cemetery Reports, Jim Aldrich: Burial fees, $200; Foundation fees, $425; Grave Sales, $700. Jim gave the trustees a rewrite of the cemetery rules and new pricing that the cemetery committee had worked out. One change would be to use a square footage fee price because we appeared to be losing money on the foundations. Jim said he will get more information on that. The price increase for the grave sites would be more in line with other communities; our prices have not changed for about 6 years.
Vic to Jim Aldrich: I have been working on the square footage price and we are at the upper end of pricing for most communities.
The roads report was fairly routine.
Veterans' Memorial, Frank Horack: The flags have been ordered and it is hoped that they will be installed by 3 weeks from now.
Also: There was a large clambake [The Ruritans, of which your blogger believes Frank is a member]on Sunday and it was reported that some kids were climbing on the plumbing of the pump and also on the cannon. Something should probably be done.
After that, Frank Horack, Jim Aldrich, and Brian Tayerle left. Larry Leitzow went out at the same time.
Discussion about speed limit signs on Skinner and Sheldon south of Rt. 82 followed: The limit declared by ODOT is 40mph on both.
Cal Brant asked what the legal speed is on our roads. Answer: Unless posted, it is 55mph.
Cal: I brought it up because Wayne Road is a shortcut between 82 and 44. People are traveling more than 55mph, and kids are riding bicycles and people are walking dogs, posing a problem.
Vic: We need to have a resolution. It has been a long time since we did this.
Jason: About zoning--the letter being used that was discussed last meeting is no longer being sent out.
Vic called attention to Lynn Harvey, who asked if she could comment.
Lynn: I was looking through the Ohio Zoning Source Book. I don't know whether John Dickey has this. To John Dickey: Does this look familiar?
John Dickey: No.
Lynn went to the table and gave a sample warning letter and one other to them, saying, I thought that might be something you might want to adopt.
Jason: Do you have a copy you can give to John Dickey?
Lynn: I would think he would have it. [Tools of the trade, after all--blogger.]
Vic: I think it came as a set. There are various subjects in the set.
Marie commented that it could be copied into the copier and saved so it could be printed off for anyone who wanted it.
Next was an issue about a property at the corner of Saint Joseph Boulevard and Pioneer Trail. The owners want to sell the house, and the issue is that the new EPA and septic regulations require that on transfer, if anyone has a system not in compliance (considered an illicit discharge0, the EPA is regulating that anyone within 400 feet of a sewer line must tie in. Other than that, there are few options.
The property is within 400 feet.
The owners were at the meeting and the wife commented that everyone seems to be aware of this, but are not doing anything because they are not planning on selling. The remedies so far look like a nightmare to tie into St. Joseph's line. The other option is to bore under the road and tie in there. The purchasers have a locked-in interest rate that they are anxious to keep.
Jason asked if anyone had a problem with boring under the road, and Vic asked some technical questions. There was some indecision about what to do, depending on the size of the line an other technical issues.
Vic: If boring is done under the road by a qualified contractor and one of our representatives is there, [that would be acceptable]. It is up to the seller.
Jason said he would talk to the right people the next day so everyone knows what is going on.
Cal Brant mentioned a mini sewage plant that is being manufactured in Cleveland and is EPA approved.
Old Business came next. There was some discussion about Halloween and keeping it in sync with the Village, which has moved Trick or Treat to October 30 from 5:30 - 7:30 to avoid a conflict with a home football game. A motion was made to follow suit, seconded and passed.
There was some discussion with Brent Simon about putting that information on the township website, as well as information about the flu clinic [already past as the blog is being done].
Vic: I had a couple of questions about the zoning. To John Dickey: Are you still using the agricultural paperwork that you had?
John Dickey: Same as we have been using all along. John Vechery had been using it.
Vic: I am talking about the one that was brought to a meeting.
Then there was a question about a BZA modification to a form.
John Dickey: They just put everything on one ____[Blogger: missed the word.]
Vic: The one I got did not have a notation about when he had signed off.
[Blogger: I believe John Dickey expressed some confusion about this. I have two question marks after his name in my notes at this point.]
Vic: We need dates on those things.
John Dickey: I don't know what you are talking about. I gave them one packet and they lost it and I had to get another one for them. [Blogger: I have heard two stories about this now. One is that John Dickey gave the packet to Betsy Woolf, who is the BZA secretary, to give to the BZA and that she lost it--with which I believe she took issue. The other is the version here. Either way, John Dickey's position is that someone else is at fault.]
Vic: Then that new form is already on the website? So we can pull it off of there.
John Dickey: Yes.
Vic stated then that was all he had under old business.
[Blogger: The next item is updates on the Township Hall, but I want to begin the next post with that instead of sticking it at the end of this one. So--done for this session.] .
Wednesday, October 8, 2014
10-2-14: Todd Peetz describes school use committees
After a few routine preliminaries, Todd Peetz, Director of Regional Planning, was introduced and spoke.
Jason: Every year we have credits we purchase from the Regional Planning office, and they are usually used for zoning. We have hired Portage County Regional Planning to assist with setting up volunteer committees for Mantua Center School.
Todd Peetz: Many of you probably received a letter from me this week or last. We will set up our first meeting to talk about using the center school. I have been coordinating with Vic but received e-mails from both Jason [Carlton] and John Festa with concerns. We received 25 letters and 7-8 local contractors regarding the committees. [Todd then named and described the committees.]
Building Assessment. Walk through the building and determine what is needed. Formulate a priority list and costs. Some things must happen right away and some can be deferred.
Next is the Volunteer Committee. Many wanted to be on that and it should probably be mostly for people wanting to help paint and landscape. Most of those who signed up may not be quite capable of the work that needs to be done.
Building Utilization: Who will use the building? Some [rooms] are being used by the township, and Family and Children's [Community] Services said they would use a room.
Finances: Grants, raising funding: Materials, labor, grants of some sort. They do not need to be historic preservation. There is a storm water grant, and that could go to the parking lot.
The groups need to work together but can not [necessarily] work at the same time.
One of the ideas was to have one person on each committee. [Blogger: I am not sure what is meant by the "one person."] The building utilization--an architect or someone from the building trades [should be on that committee.] There should also be some residents to keep transparency.
[Blogger: Jason's e-mail expressed the opinion that only professionals in the building trades should be on that committee.]
You can't volunteer until everything is in place. The donations is probably the second most important committee. The utilization committee has to determine the costs before the funding can be pursued.
Rental: You have to be affordable enough to rent the space.
The idea is to come together to make this successful. There is no sense in beating each other up over this, but to be positive and not to burden the township. [Blogger's italics. I spoke recently with someone who had started by being opposed to the township buying the school, but now he thinks we should go ahead. When I asked about the change, he said, "We own it now. We should make use of it."]
Todd mentioned interviews: I looked at the resumes and decided not to spend 20 or 30 hours interviewing and perhaps insulting people; I thought I can find places for them to go.
Jason: A first concern is making sure when you sent us the spread sheet of everyone, one of my concerns is that some people wanted to help in every area. But perhaps that person might lose focus.
Todd: One way to make sure that people stay involved would be to have periodic reports so everyone knows what is going on. That way it would not be necessary to be on every committee.
Jason: I thought we would leave that to the discretion of your team. The building assessment committee: they should understand what is involved, but it is not a bad idea to put a couple of resident-volunteers on it but I think it should be primarily staffed with professionals.
Todd: This is the most important committee because it determines the cost. It looks big, but not if you take bites of it and phase it in. Then on to the utilization/grants people to see how to get it going. If we can not get donations of labor, then cash.
John Festa: Asked for an e-mail to be sent to all as we go forward. It is nice to be kept in the loop.
Todd: When I got your e-mail expressing some concerns I realized I should have invited myself to this meeting so you would know what is going on.
John Festa: Are you going to release those committees?
Todd: On October 22. The building committee should be contractors with other interested people. Volunteers: If you are physically able and/or have skills. Also, people who can go find help.
John Festa: Another small concern--you sent everyone on those lists a letter. What if someone can't come?
Todd: If all the contractors don't show up on October 22, I am not going to be heartbroken about that. Then the contractors need all to come out at the same time and go through the building. They should be in one group to be able to share ideas.
John Festa: Other than that, I want to tell you I appreciate your being our partner.
Vic: I feel you have been on target with this.
The date of the meeting to set things in motion is Wednesday, October 22, at 7 p.m. in the Civic Center.
[Blogger: It is a public meeting. Everyone can attend to see how this project gets launched and to understand what actually was said. There is no substitute for being there, even if you did not volunteer for a committee.]
Jason: Every year we have credits we purchase from the Regional Planning office, and they are usually used for zoning. We have hired Portage County Regional Planning to assist with setting up volunteer committees for Mantua Center School.
Todd Peetz: Many of you probably received a letter from me this week or last. We will set up our first meeting to talk about using the center school. I have been coordinating with Vic but received e-mails from both Jason [Carlton] and John Festa with concerns. We received 25 letters and 7-8 local contractors regarding the committees. [Todd then named and described the committees.]
Building Assessment. Walk through the building and determine what is needed. Formulate a priority list and costs. Some things must happen right away and some can be deferred.
Next is the Volunteer Committee. Many wanted to be on that and it should probably be mostly for people wanting to help paint and landscape. Most of those who signed up may not be quite capable of the work that needs to be done.
Building Utilization: Who will use the building? Some [rooms] are being used by the township, and Family and Children's [Community] Services said they would use a room.
Finances: Grants, raising funding: Materials, labor, grants of some sort. They do not need to be historic preservation. There is a storm water grant, and that could go to the parking lot.
The groups need to work together but can not [necessarily] work at the same time.
One of the ideas was to have one person on each committee. [Blogger: I am not sure what is meant by the "one person."] The building utilization--an architect or someone from the building trades [should be on that committee.] There should also be some residents to keep transparency.
[Blogger: Jason's e-mail expressed the opinion that only professionals in the building trades should be on that committee.]
You can't volunteer until everything is in place. The donations is probably the second most important committee. The utilization committee has to determine the costs before the funding can be pursued.
Rental: You have to be affordable enough to rent the space.
The idea is to come together to make this successful. There is no sense in beating each other up over this, but to be positive and not to burden the township. [Blogger's italics. I spoke recently with someone who had started by being opposed to the township buying the school, but now he thinks we should go ahead. When I asked about the change, he said, "We own it now. We should make use of it."]
Todd mentioned interviews: I looked at the resumes and decided not to spend 20 or 30 hours interviewing and perhaps insulting people; I thought I can find places for them to go.
Jason: A first concern is making sure when you sent us the spread sheet of everyone, one of my concerns is that some people wanted to help in every area. But perhaps that person might lose focus.
Todd: One way to make sure that people stay involved would be to have periodic reports so everyone knows what is going on. That way it would not be necessary to be on every committee.
Jason: I thought we would leave that to the discretion of your team. The building assessment committee: they should understand what is involved, but it is not a bad idea to put a couple of resident-volunteers on it but I think it should be primarily staffed with professionals.
Todd: This is the most important committee because it determines the cost. It looks big, but not if you take bites of it and phase it in. Then on to the utilization/grants people to see how to get it going. If we can not get donations of labor, then cash.
John Festa: Asked for an e-mail to be sent to all as we go forward. It is nice to be kept in the loop.
Todd: When I got your e-mail expressing some concerns I realized I should have invited myself to this meeting so you would know what is going on.
John Festa: Are you going to release those committees?
Todd: On October 22. The building committee should be contractors with other interested people. Volunteers: If you are physically able and/or have skills. Also, people who can go find help.
John Festa: Another small concern--you sent everyone on those lists a letter. What if someone can't come?
Todd: If all the contractors don't show up on October 22, I am not going to be heartbroken about that. Then the contractors need all to come out at the same time and go through the building. They should be in one group to be able to share ideas.
John Festa: Other than that, I want to tell you I appreciate your being our partner.
Vic: I feel you have been on target with this.
The date of the meeting to set things in motion is Wednesday, October 22, at 7 p.m. in the Civic Center.
[Blogger: It is a public meeting. Everyone can attend to see how this project gets launched and to understand what actually was said. There is no substitute for being there, even if you did not volunteer for a committee.]
Wednesday, October 1, 2014
Todd Peetz to speak at 10-2 trustees mtg.
Todd Peetz has said that he wants everyone to hear the same message about the school use committees. As part of that intention, he will be at the trustees meeting on Thursday, October 2, at 7:30 p.m. in the Mantua Township Hall.
This is a chance for everyone to hear what Todd intends for the school use committees and how he sees them working. After that, word on the street may be spun or distorted. Now, why would anyone possibly do that? That question doesn't even need to be asked, if you have been reading the blog.
Anyhow--please make the effort to come. Lots of things can be caught up with; some things only happen once. Those are the things worth changing a schedule to get to. This is one of those things.
This is a chance for everyone to hear what Todd intends for the school use committees and how he sees them working. After that, word on the street may be spun or distorted. Now, why would anyone possibly do that? That question doesn't even need to be asked, if you have been reading the blog.
Anyhow--please make the effort to come. Lots of things can be caught up with; some things only happen once. Those are the things worth changing a schedule to get to. This is one of those things.
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