This is being posted on Wednesday, May 16, so the first couple of programs would have to be accessed on the WKSU or NPR website. The segments are running this week; I heard them in the morning. Broadcasts begin at 5:00 a.m. (!), shifting to music at 9:00, just to define the window.
wksu.org 89.7FM
npr.org
The segments discuss the effects of fracking on the health of people where there is a lot of new drilling. If you are reading this on Wednesday, there is going to be a segment in the afternoon, All Things Considered, which airs between 4 and 6 or 6:30.
The WKSU website is very easy to use, if you have not gone to it before.
I thought, given the interest in fracking on a previous blog post, that people might be interested in hearing or reading for themselves, rather than trying to present the information myself.
Wednesday, May 16, 2012
Wednesday, May 9, 2012
Syrup for the Waffles, Please!
This post is the last segment of public comment from the May 3, 2012, Mantua Township Trustees meeting.
Dave Pollard: Vic, at the last meeting I believe you mentioned that each room in the school has its own thermostat. So there is no basis for the claim that having one office there would mean having to heat the whole building.
The other is that at the last meeting you mentioned that you basically have a paper trail to show how the asbestos was disposed of.
Vic: There was no asbestos--that is on the report. We hired a man from Shalersville and he tested it and found it negative.
Our guys took out the ceiling in the hallway and we have a receipt for it. [Note: this is a receipt from the disposal facility, where such construction debris is required by law to be disposed of.]
Vic, continuing: The gentleman who came out from Air Quality in Akron [an EPA affiliate or arm] took samples on the plaster and the piping wrap and the floor tile. He said, "If you don't hear from me, continue on."
Dave asked both Jason and John Festa if they understood. He pushed both Jason and John Festa to acknowledge that they had heard and understood what Vic had said.
Dave continued: I want to be sure of that because apparently there is a flat-out lie circulating on the private website. If all three of you have heard and understand, then [I would expect you to do what] any honest and ethical person would do. After Vic made that report at the last meeting, that lie came out and was put out for the public to see. Apparently there is no basis for the comment that Mark Hall told the road crew to haul this out and dispose of it in any way.
[Larry Leitzow or a really good mimic of him could be heard muttering at that point.]
[Blogger: I am not sure whom Mark was accused of telling. What was stated clearly was the lie about him.]
Jason said that he was not a tester of asbestos, among several other remarks that avoided coming to grips with the real question. Dave wanted to be sure that now that all three trustees had the same information, if they encountered that lie out in the township they would be able to shut it down as any honest and ethical person would do.
Jason never really answered that.
John Festa's final and only response was, "I heard what he said."
[Blogger: That is a counseling response, used when the client is trying to get the counselor to support the client. Festa's remark does not indicate that he understood WHAT was said, only that he heard the sounds. Dave's point--which the two junior trustees understood perfectly well, or they could not have dodged it so determinedly--was whether they would now address and correct the lie.]
Dave, continuing: Also, you are going to hire someone and last year I offered to mow the roade and ditches at less cost than that.
Dan Cousins: Can Vic bring the report [on asbestos] to the next meeting so we don't have to go through this all t he time?
[Blogger: All of the repeated ad nauseum harping about asbestos could have been eliminated at the beginning by a simple records request: ten cents a page, certainly no hardship for someone who sounded proud to say that he has $2 million insurance coverage on a piece of equipment. But having the report would have eliminated the opportunities for bullying and repeating the dread word "asbestos" for the public to hear. Remember: throw enough mud at a wall long enough, and some of the mud will stick,even if the whole thing is bogus and especially if no one else checks the facts.]
Dan also asked about the equipment rental bids and asked if one piece of equipment is used more than any other.
Vic: A couple of years ago we used John Zoka (sp??? The phonetics are right; not sure about the spelling.)
He has a machine that is excellent. There was more detail about the machine.
Dan: Is there a separate electric and gas bill per month?
Marie: It has cost/been less to heat the school than the garage this year.
Dan: Everyone can say that this year.
Jason: We can get that information to you.
Vic: We can split the gas bill for the gymnasium.
Marie: That is probably less than the tenant who was going to rent from us.
Dan also asked about the health care--that it was supposed to drop or be reduced at some point.
Vic: They owe us some money yet.
Jason: They owe us quite a bit of money.
Larry Leitzow: Probably Vic or Jason: How many funerals do we average per week?
Vic: It varies. Some years we could have as many as 40, and some years as few as 10.
Larry: Probably one per week average. [Blogger: I know that a Ph.D. in English means that I am numerically challenged, but does this compute?]
Larry: So if you take two road crew it takes a day. So it's no wonder that the roads have been bad with all the funerals.
Also: on the school: everything is to get in that school. We have no idea how much money we have in it. Everything revolves around the school. [Blogger: Everything revolves around the school because Larry and his cohorts have harped on it for the past 2 years. And, having said at one point that he had been mistaken about the cost of $600,000 or so, but that it was actually closer to $650K or even $675K, Larry is now not sure what we have spent? And for anyone who is going to quibble about whether the above figures are accurate, the point is not the figures, but the process: Keep on hammering away about the school. First it took too long for us to be even close to getting in. Now that we are within striking distance of occupancy, we shouldn't get in, and besides, it has cost too much. If we--according to Larry--don't know how much we have spent, how can the claim be made that too much has been spent? And why delay renting it, thus preventing it from supporting itself to whatever extent is possible for a public building? Delay was presented as waste before. It still looks like waste, to me.
And apparently, if people had the good grace not to die, the roads would be in better shape. Did I miss something?]
Larry: [Back to the asbestos]: There is more to it than the ceiling and the hallway. Before you bought the school did you ever gest a copy of it.
Vic: I don't know if we do have a copy, if we got it from the school.
Dawn Pechman: A couple of things. Records. I would like a copy of the papers you have. What year was it?
Vic: Asbestos.
Dawn: The guy came out and looked at the ?? [Sorry!]
Vic: It was about 2010.
Dawn made some records/letters requests. One from Marie and two from Cal Brant. John's letter from Chris Meduri--I want that.
Dawn also said something about actually addressing something about records.
Dawn: Do you know how much money has been spent.
Jason: How much money has been spent on the school is past history.
Dawn: $538,000. Breakdowns are available. I want to ask that not one [more] dime go into that school and not one more hour of volunteer work go into it and that it not be discussed [further] in these meetings.
[Blogger: At this point, between a conversation that Amy Janka was carrying on in the back corner on her way out, and the open door with all the noise from the road, Dawn was nearly drowned out.]
At 9:18 a motion was made to pay the bills.
Final blogger note: This is not a transcript. However, I have rechecked things, and what is here is true to the tone and direction of what was said. My commentary or background or insertions to improve the clarity of someone's remarks are all bracketed. You can skip those if you want. The insertions are there because what is clear when we are all in the meeting comes across as more fragmented when it is in print.
Dave Pollard: Vic, at the last meeting I believe you mentioned that each room in the school has its own thermostat. So there is no basis for the claim that having one office there would mean having to heat the whole building.
The other is that at the last meeting you mentioned that you basically have a paper trail to show how the asbestos was disposed of.
Vic: There was no asbestos--that is on the report. We hired a man from Shalersville and he tested it and found it negative.
Our guys took out the ceiling in the hallway and we have a receipt for it. [Note: this is a receipt from the disposal facility, where such construction debris is required by law to be disposed of.]
Vic, continuing: The gentleman who came out from Air Quality in Akron [an EPA affiliate or arm] took samples on the plaster and the piping wrap and the floor tile. He said, "If you don't hear from me, continue on."
Dave asked both Jason and John Festa if they understood. He pushed both Jason and John Festa to acknowledge that they had heard and understood what Vic had said.
Dave continued: I want to be sure of that because apparently there is a flat-out lie circulating on the private website. If all three of you have heard and understand, then [I would expect you to do what] any honest and ethical person would do. After Vic made that report at the last meeting, that lie came out and was put out for the public to see. Apparently there is no basis for the comment that Mark Hall told the road crew to haul this out and dispose of it in any way.
[Larry Leitzow or a really good mimic of him could be heard muttering at that point.]
[Blogger: I am not sure whom Mark was accused of telling. What was stated clearly was the lie about him.]
Jason said that he was not a tester of asbestos, among several other remarks that avoided coming to grips with the real question. Dave wanted to be sure that now that all three trustees had the same information, if they encountered that lie out in the township they would be able to shut it down as any honest and ethical person would do.
Jason never really answered that.
John Festa's final and only response was, "I heard what he said."
[Blogger: That is a counseling response, used when the client is trying to get the counselor to support the client. Festa's remark does not indicate that he understood WHAT was said, only that he heard the sounds. Dave's point--which the two junior trustees understood perfectly well, or they could not have dodged it so determinedly--was whether they would now address and correct the lie.]
Dave, continuing: Also, you are going to hire someone and last year I offered to mow the roade and ditches at less cost than that.
Dan Cousins: Can Vic bring the report [on asbestos] to the next meeting so we don't have to go through this all t he time?
[Blogger: All of the repeated ad nauseum harping about asbestos could have been eliminated at the beginning by a simple records request: ten cents a page, certainly no hardship for someone who sounded proud to say that he has $2 million insurance coverage on a piece of equipment. But having the report would have eliminated the opportunities for bullying and repeating the dread word "asbestos" for the public to hear. Remember: throw enough mud at a wall long enough, and some of the mud will stick,even if the whole thing is bogus and especially if no one else checks the facts.]
Dan also asked about the equipment rental bids and asked if one piece of equipment is used more than any other.
Vic: A couple of years ago we used John Zoka (sp??? The phonetics are right; not sure about the spelling.)
He has a machine that is excellent. There was more detail about the machine.
Dan: Is there a separate electric and gas bill per month?
Marie: It has cost/been less to heat the school than the garage this year.
Dan: Everyone can say that this year.
Jason: We can get that information to you.
Vic: We can split the gas bill for the gymnasium.
Marie: That is probably less than the tenant who was going to rent from us.
Dan also asked about the health care--that it was supposed to drop or be reduced at some point.
Vic: They owe us some money yet.
Jason: They owe us quite a bit of money.
Larry Leitzow: Probably Vic or Jason: How many funerals do we average per week?
Vic: It varies. Some years we could have as many as 40, and some years as few as 10.
Larry: Probably one per week average. [Blogger: I know that a Ph.D. in English means that I am numerically challenged, but does this compute?]
Larry: So if you take two road crew it takes a day. So it's no wonder that the roads have been bad with all the funerals.
Also: on the school: everything is to get in that school. We have no idea how much money we have in it. Everything revolves around the school. [Blogger: Everything revolves around the school because Larry and his cohorts have harped on it for the past 2 years. And, having said at one point that he had been mistaken about the cost of $600,000 or so, but that it was actually closer to $650K or even $675K, Larry is now not sure what we have spent? And for anyone who is going to quibble about whether the above figures are accurate, the point is not the figures, but the process: Keep on hammering away about the school. First it took too long for us to be even close to getting in. Now that we are within striking distance of occupancy, we shouldn't get in, and besides, it has cost too much. If we--according to Larry--don't know how much we have spent, how can the claim be made that too much has been spent? And why delay renting it, thus preventing it from supporting itself to whatever extent is possible for a public building? Delay was presented as waste before. It still looks like waste, to me.
And apparently, if people had the good grace not to die, the roads would be in better shape. Did I miss something?]
Larry: [Back to the asbestos]: There is more to it than the ceiling and the hallway. Before you bought the school did you ever gest a copy of it.
Vic: I don't know if we do have a copy, if we got it from the school.
Dawn Pechman: A couple of things. Records. I would like a copy of the papers you have. What year was it?
Vic: Asbestos.
Dawn: The guy came out and looked at the ?? [Sorry!]
Vic: It was about 2010.
Dawn made some records/letters requests. One from Marie and two from Cal Brant. John's letter from Chris Meduri--I want that.
Dawn also said something about actually addressing something about records.
Dawn: Do you know how much money has been spent.
Jason: How much money has been spent on the school is past history.
Dawn: $538,000. Breakdowns are available. I want to ask that not one [more] dime go into that school and not one more hour of volunteer work go into it and that it not be discussed [further] in these meetings.
[Blogger: At this point, between a conversation that Amy Janka was carrying on in the back corner on her way out, and the open door with all the noise from the road, Dawn was nearly drowned out.]
At 9:18 a motion was made to pay the bills.
Final blogger note: This is not a transcript. However, I have rechecked things, and what is here is true to the tone and direction of what was said. My commentary or background or insertions to improve the clarity of someone's remarks are all bracketed. You can skip those if you want. The insertions are there because what is clear when we are all in the meeting comes across as more fragmented when it is in print.
Tuesday, May 8, 2012
Tap Dancing and Earnest Avoidance
Foreword: This will probably be another longish post, partly because all of the parts lead logically into one another and partly because I want to get this meeting done with dispatch.
If I had known at the blog's inception just how laborious a full transcript is, I would have put something like that in the header--that on occasion something may be a full transcript, but mostly the entries will be what is called an informative summary, comment by comment. If I think I missed something significant, I find a way to check it and correct it if appropriate.
The following remarks are continued from public comment at the May 3, 2012, Mantua Township Trustees meeting.
Carole Pollard: I want to add to/piggyback on what Mark Hall said. All of the costs you [to Jason and John Festa] mentioned are pretty much one-time costs. Weed and feed on the ball fields, potentially harmful, has to be done every year. You are looking at one time costs, and all the rooms do not have to be carpeted. As far as sending it to the people is concerned, that would probably get us the same results as the last election, which was manufactured.
To John Festa: Who accompanied you when you visited Randy Roberts at the building department? He [Randy] said you had someone come with you when you came to talk with him.
John Festa: He had a question and I had a question and he [Randy] invited both of us into his office.
Carole: You are an elected official who took a non-elected person on township business. I think we have the right to expect that someone presented as capable and experienced should be able to do this without a chaperone.
Carol Srajer, Winchell Road: Question: is there any way that part of the downstairs could be walled off in some way and that would put Marie in on the ground level so the work could be done?
Jason: I think we need to consider all possibilities. I have to sit down and get some cost analysis. We ought to consider every possibility. I had not thought of that in the past.
Carol: You keep talking about access to her office and if we want to do something right away and she is on the main floor, then there is no question.
Marie: It will take one wall and a door. [Blogger's note: This is all that would be required in the room designated for Marie's office to give the two spaces--one to work in and one for storage--in the room.]
Vic Grimm: The nice thing about the room Marie would like to get into is that the handicapped parking is right outside that window.
Carol Srajer: Can she be put somewhere temporarily?
Vic: We have the door she is talking about; it just needs to be set in place.
Cal Brant, Wayne Road: I missed the discussion on my proposal, but the figure amount was for materials. The labor would be donated. How many people have needed handicapped accessibility to Marie's office so far? You said you wanted to give that choice to the public about setting up Marie's office. You were elected to make decisions for the public.
Jason: I was not a trustee in 2004. What has happened in the past 8 years?
Cal: I am confused. One time you say you will make the decisions and another you want to send it to the people. We are ready to move forward right now.
Jason: Why now and why not 5, 6, 7 years ago. I don't think we are ready right now. This building has been piecemealed together for 8 years and a full cost analysis needs to be done. As long as I am chairman I am not going to move to get into that building until we can get onto the whole [first] floor and accessibility issues are addressed.
Cal: That is your opinion.
Vic: Not until we began the blueprints on the gymnasium did they [the building department] consider that an assembly area. They finally agreed with us that there was no change in the use and up until that point the other building department head had looked at it differently.
[Blogger's note: If you haven't been following the discussions about the school building, if the use of a building is changed from what it had been before it passed to a new owner, all current codes must be met, and the red tape--not to mention the expense--is huge. The trustees up until now have worked very hard to keep the designated uses of the building the same as before they purchased it.]
Cal: We have not moved forward before because of politics. [Some] things have changed in the past year to allow us to do what we intended in the beginning, as far as a cost analysis is concerned, what do you mean by cost analysis?
Jason: I said it.
Cal: The whole first floor?
Jason: Yes.
Cal: What is your concern about what has been done? Can you provide us with a list so people who are going to do the work can see what [is] to be done?
Jason: I am all for this--I just want it done the right way.
Cal: No one has seen a list. Can you provide us with one so we can begin?
Jason: I am not saying we are against it.
Cal: Can you provide that list so we do not have to keep coming back every two weeks and hear the same stall? You want a plan. I don't see a plan. [Blogger's boldface.]
Jason: This is a priority but not my top priority. My top priority is the roads. I think a plan is absolutely in order. There are only so many hours in a day.
Cal: You or the other trustees. So everything has to go through you?
At this point Jason stopped the conversation with Cal to move forward; Cal protested; Jason went ahead.
Matt Parsons: Hypothetically, if we move into the first floor, will there be official hours?
Jason: I will let Marie answer.
Marie: I do not have a plan, but according to [ORC?] I do not have to have set hours.
Matt: Are we going to get three [ideas?] and not [just] a proposal from one person?
Marie: It wasn't done on this [looking around at the Township Hall.] [Note: If the work on the Township Hall was discussed before it was done, it took less time than was devoted to deflecting Cal's proposal, if I remember correctly. If that work was discussed at all. What I do remember is driving past the Township Hall and seeing a bunch of cars and the door wide open. There may have been a trustee there. There may.]
Jason: I am hoping we can have a bunch of volunteers.
Vic: You already have them.
Jason: I am hoping we can fast-track this because there is a real need.
Larry Parsons: On hiring another employee: I think it is a good idea. The roads are in better shape than they have been before. [Blogger: And we had the mildest winter in three years; that makes a difference in the road conditions come spring.] The ditches are mowed also. If we do not have set office hours, will the utilities offset the use?
Will there be tenants to offset the expense: It does not make sense to pay the utilities for just one tenant.
Jason: There is not just Marie. There are other township tenants. I think the annex is a better idea than doing things on two floors. [??]
Amy Janka: I just want to thank and commend the road crew along the lines of what has been said before. I have not seen the ditches mowed that nicely in a long time.
Barbara Herbold: No comment.
If I had known at the blog's inception just how laborious a full transcript is, I would have put something like that in the header--that on occasion something may be a full transcript, but mostly the entries will be what is called an informative summary, comment by comment. If I think I missed something significant, I find a way to check it and correct it if appropriate.
The following remarks are continued from public comment at the May 3, 2012, Mantua Township Trustees meeting.
Carole Pollard: I want to add to/piggyback on what Mark Hall said. All of the costs you [to Jason and John Festa] mentioned are pretty much one-time costs. Weed and feed on the ball fields, potentially harmful, has to be done every year. You are looking at one time costs, and all the rooms do not have to be carpeted. As far as sending it to the people is concerned, that would probably get us the same results as the last election, which was manufactured.
To John Festa: Who accompanied you when you visited Randy Roberts at the building department? He [Randy] said you had someone come with you when you came to talk with him.
John Festa: He had a question and I had a question and he [Randy] invited both of us into his office.
Carole: You are an elected official who took a non-elected person on township business. I think we have the right to expect that someone presented as capable and experienced should be able to do this without a chaperone.
Carol Srajer, Winchell Road: Question: is there any way that part of the downstairs could be walled off in some way and that would put Marie in on the ground level so the work could be done?
Jason: I think we need to consider all possibilities. I have to sit down and get some cost analysis. We ought to consider every possibility. I had not thought of that in the past.
Carol: You keep talking about access to her office and if we want to do something right away and she is on the main floor, then there is no question.
Marie: It will take one wall and a door. [Blogger's note: This is all that would be required in the room designated for Marie's office to give the two spaces--one to work in and one for storage--in the room.]
Vic Grimm: The nice thing about the room Marie would like to get into is that the handicapped parking is right outside that window.
Carol Srajer: Can she be put somewhere temporarily?
Vic: We have the door she is talking about; it just needs to be set in place.
Cal Brant, Wayne Road: I missed the discussion on my proposal, but the figure amount was for materials. The labor would be donated. How many people have needed handicapped accessibility to Marie's office so far? You said you wanted to give that choice to the public about setting up Marie's office. You were elected to make decisions for the public.
Jason: I was not a trustee in 2004. What has happened in the past 8 years?
Cal: I am confused. One time you say you will make the decisions and another you want to send it to the people. We are ready to move forward right now.
Jason: Why now and why not 5, 6, 7 years ago. I don't think we are ready right now. This building has been piecemealed together for 8 years and a full cost analysis needs to be done. As long as I am chairman I am not going to move to get into that building until we can get onto the whole [first] floor and accessibility issues are addressed.
Cal: That is your opinion.
Vic: Not until we began the blueprints on the gymnasium did they [the building department] consider that an assembly area. They finally agreed with us that there was no change in the use and up until that point the other building department head had looked at it differently.
[Blogger's note: If you haven't been following the discussions about the school building, if the use of a building is changed from what it had been before it passed to a new owner, all current codes must be met, and the red tape--not to mention the expense--is huge. The trustees up until now have worked very hard to keep the designated uses of the building the same as before they purchased it.]
Cal: We have not moved forward before because of politics. [Some] things have changed in the past year to allow us to do what we intended in the beginning, as far as a cost analysis is concerned, what do you mean by cost analysis?
Jason: I said it.
Cal: The whole first floor?
Jason: Yes.
Cal: What is your concern about what has been done? Can you provide us with a list so people who are going to do the work can see what [is] to be done?
Jason: I am all for this--I just want it done the right way.
Cal: No one has seen a list. Can you provide us with one so we can begin?
Jason: I am not saying we are against it.
Cal: Can you provide that list so we do not have to keep coming back every two weeks and hear the same stall? You want a plan. I don't see a plan. [Blogger's boldface.]
Jason: This is a priority but not my top priority. My top priority is the roads. I think a plan is absolutely in order. There are only so many hours in a day.
Cal: You or the other trustees. So everything has to go through you?
At this point Jason stopped the conversation with Cal to move forward; Cal protested; Jason went ahead.
Matt Parsons: Hypothetically, if we move into the first floor, will there be official hours?
Jason: I will let Marie answer.
Marie: I do not have a plan, but according to [ORC?] I do not have to have set hours.
Matt: Are we going to get three [ideas?] and not [just] a proposal from one person?
Marie: It wasn't done on this [looking around at the Township Hall.] [Note: If the work on the Township Hall was discussed before it was done, it took less time than was devoted to deflecting Cal's proposal, if I remember correctly. If that work was discussed at all. What I do remember is driving past the Township Hall and seeing a bunch of cars and the door wide open. There may have been a trustee there. There may.]
Jason: I am hoping we can have a bunch of volunteers.
Vic: You already have them.
Jason: I am hoping we can fast-track this because there is a real need.
Larry Parsons: On hiring another employee: I think it is a good idea. The roads are in better shape than they have been before. [Blogger: And we had the mildest winter in three years; that makes a difference in the road conditions come spring.] The ditches are mowed also. If we do not have set office hours, will the utilities offset the use?
Will there be tenants to offset the expense: It does not make sense to pay the utilities for just one tenant.
Jason: There is not just Marie. There are other township tenants. I think the annex is a better idea than doing things on two floors. [??]
Amy Janka: I just want to thank and commend the road crew along the lines of what has been said before. I have not seen the ditches mowed that nicely in a long time.
Barbara Herbold: No comment.
Sunday, May 6, 2012
Volunteer Offer Ignored; Is Festa the only Trustee?
This is the second post for the Mantua Township Trustees meeting on May 3, 2012.
Foreword: I am not sure what category the following notes fall under, since Jason did not provide an agenda for this meeting and I am not sure whether he consistently stated what part of the meeting was being conducted.
Vic: Everything is set up for Spring Cleanup on May 12. In addition, a separate dumpster will be on hand for the tire turn-in next weekend.
The small flags have been purchased for the cemetery. The cost has gone up a bit from past years. Brian Tayerle is taking care of those.
Jason: I have still been getting calls about the catch basins at Aurora Meadows. Then Jason asked for John Vechery's Zoning and cemetery reports.
John Vechery: For April, zoning collected $195.00 and the cemetery, $3,115, for a total of $3,310.
Flags have been ordered. They should be here any time now at the VA office.
Foundations [for headstones] have been marked and are ready to be dug and poured.
[Blogger: I don't know whether what follows is New Business or Trustees' Reports, but here it is.]
Vic: I have a cost estimate from Cal Brant for Marie Stehli's office. It looks like to renovate it with new carpeting would come to about $1900. Vic passed the letter to Jason, who looked at it and passed it to John Festa. I did not see what was done with it then, since I was making notes.
No comment or acknowledgment was made. Jason moved on to Old Business.
Marie presented the contractors'/operators' bids for equipment and labor rates. The Township does this every year in order to have the use of equipment that does not have to be owned by the township because it is not used often enough to justify that kind of expense.
The contractors list their equipment and the rates to rent it. It has been the township's practice to accept all bids at this time of year so that when a piece of equipment is needed for a day or a job, the appropriate contractor can be called. Many to most of the local contractors work hard to keep their rates stable for as long as possible.
Anyone who wants that information can find it in the meeting minutes or make a public records request. The minutes would be more economical of money and Marie's time.
Vic made a motion to accept all the bids. Jason seconded; unanimous.
Jason asked if there was any additional old business.
John Festa: Asked about progress on the website. Jason said he had been working with Brent Simon to develop the front page and invited Brent to comment. Brent said the site is almost ready for content.
John Festa: More and more township websites have a newsletter on the website that discusses things people like to know about in the community. I got the Township magazine [Blogger: A publication of the Ohio Township Association, I believe] this month and there was a pretty good article about promoting your township. It talks about newsletters as a great way to promote the township.
John Festa, continuing: Maybe we can get some students at the high school to work on that. I would like to pursue that and give a report at the next meeting. I would like to pursue that if everyone is in agreement.
Jason: A great [good?] idea.
Vic: That's fine.
John Festa: Chris Meduri is sending a letter out to the party involved with the trailer at the school. [Note: This is one of two trailers; the auction of the other was announced in the part of the meeting in the previous post.]
[Blogger: This is the tenant who was waiting for the basement to be completed in order to set up a pre-school. One of the great criticisms of the purchase of the school was that the Trustees had no tenant. They did. But with the new township order as of the last election, she is being sent packing.]
John Festa, continuing: He (Chris) thought it would be a good idea if they got a letter from him. It is pretty blunt and to the point. I would like to save her the embarrassment of an eviction.
Vic had not received anything at this point but thought it may have been faxed to him.
John Festa gave Vic a copy.
Public Comment began at about 8:34. Jason reminded everyone that comment was to be about Township business only and that remarks should be brief, since a fair number of people had signed on for comment.
Mark Hall: To John Festa: About four weeks ago you communicated with mantuatwp.com. They have given you a response to your inquiry. With whom were you communicating? Festa did not know.
Mark: So you have no idea whom you were talking to.
Continuing: The question last time was whether the[new] full time employee would be in addition to the 2 full time and one part time employee [already on the payroll]. I believe Vic inquired about how to pay for it. The response at that time was we'll have to look at the budget.
Tonight you are talking about painting the Town Hall and records storage. When these items come up, you don't need a plan, but when it is the school, you want a cost analysis and plan. How come the difference [in approach]?
Jason: I don't think the part time was supposed to last. [Blogger's Note: No, it was not supposed to last. That hire was for someone to be on call for snow plowing during the winter. He is still working close to full time hours, having started during the winter regardless of the snow, from what I can tell. A records request for time cards would make that quite clear.]
Jason, continuing: The part time [position] is to phase out. But right now there is a strong need for [a] part time [employee]. " In addition to part time" was probably not the right word. Part time will end very soon and probably when a full time hire is brought on board. [Blogger: As USA TV channel says, "Watch what
happens."]
Jason also asked Marie for something about the budget.
Then, to Mark: Currently there is a very clear plan, just [not?--blogger's uncertainty about phrasing] which fund we want to move it out of. In Road and Bridge we have $97,000. We also have $25,000 in improving of sites [?] in road and bridge. We have $5,000 in Machinery & Equipment. We can pull from any one of those accounts and put it into salaries. We can take salaries from Road and Bridge.
I don't know why the concern about not having enough money here.
Mark: When the question came up at the last meeting, the source [of the money] was not defined. The decision was made to move ahead. Two weeks has passed and evidently you have taken a look at it.
Jason: I took a look at this two weeks ago.
Mark: Two weeks ago, [the comment was] don't know how we are going to pay for it--we will just have to find the money.
Marie: The road and bridge fund amounts can not continue for long. We have carryover. Overall you can probably hire someone this year but I can not say they could stay on for another year.
Jason: We have a service to provide for the Township and I think the Township appreciates what has been done. I have heard nothing but good comments. We pay a lot in contracted services. If we are able to have someone on a mower and two guys doing other things, we are more efficient.
The thing is it is very taxing on Brian, training . If we bring in someone for summer help, we can not just bring someone in and expect him to run it [whatever the equipment is]. Nine dollars an hour for summer help gives you that quality of help.
Vic: That $25,000 was set aside to do repair work on the salt shed, so we will have to look at that.
Someone had come in fairly late and was sitting in the front row. Things seemed pretty informal at this point, and he asked how much the hourly rate is for employees. Answer: (Jason) $12.75 plus benefits.
The newcomer commented, I don't know of anyone who would be willing to work for just a year.
Jason, to Mark: Your other question?
Mark: You summed it up. Also--are you going to take Cal's offer? I am willing to help out. That might reduce the $1900.
Jason: To address that, there is a need and we have to figure out how to address it. We can move into the building but there are a lot of things that need to be addressed.
Accessibility: I can not foresee having a public building for someone who can not go up to the second floor. We do not necessarily have to come up to full ADA, but we need to address that. There are also some costs that Cal Brant outlined--painting, floor work, moving chalk boards.
The way it was handled in the past, it was bought in 2004, and the only part being used right now is the annex--we are 8 years down the road and we only have a portion open.
[Blogger: Jason was elected 2-1/2 years ago having stated in the League of Women Voters tabloid that he would work to get us into the old Center School. Since then, he has opposed spending any money on the building, has said that he would sell the school if the price was right, and put in one short evening of work only in the gymnasium to prepare for the open house last July. If he had been as good as his campaign word, it is reasonable to think that we just might be further along than we are. I find his statement about lack of progress, given his lack of effort, to be disingenuous. And that would be a great "word for the day" to look up.]
Jason, continuing: I don't want to piecemeal but want a full cost analysis.
Mark: It is no less accessible than where the office is right now. People can come into the annex and Marie can meet them.
Jason: Marie's office is not a public establishment.
[Blogger: That's enough for now. This post is already long. The way everything unfolded at this meeting, one thing led right into another into another, and finding a place to break is a challenge. The discussion about the school will continue in the next post. In my opinion, this meeting goes a long, long way to defining very clearly what is going on in the township now--the issues, the attitudes, the stonewalling and the waffling when called to be accountable. Taken a sentence at a time, many comments from the two junior trustees sound unobjectionable and responsible. In context, the bloom goes off.]
.
Foreword: I am not sure what category the following notes fall under, since Jason did not provide an agenda for this meeting and I am not sure whether he consistently stated what part of the meeting was being conducted.
Vic: Everything is set up for Spring Cleanup on May 12. In addition, a separate dumpster will be on hand for the tire turn-in next weekend.
The small flags have been purchased for the cemetery. The cost has gone up a bit from past years. Brian Tayerle is taking care of those.
Jason: I have still been getting calls about the catch basins at Aurora Meadows. Then Jason asked for John Vechery's Zoning and cemetery reports.
John Vechery: For April, zoning collected $195.00 and the cemetery, $3,115, for a total of $3,310.
Flags have been ordered. They should be here any time now at the VA office.
Foundations [for headstones] have been marked and are ready to be dug and poured.
[Blogger: I don't know whether what follows is New Business or Trustees' Reports, but here it is.]
Vic: I have a cost estimate from Cal Brant for Marie Stehli's office. It looks like to renovate it with new carpeting would come to about $1900. Vic passed the letter to Jason, who looked at it and passed it to John Festa. I did not see what was done with it then, since I was making notes.
No comment or acknowledgment was made. Jason moved on to Old Business.
Marie presented the contractors'/operators' bids for equipment and labor rates. The Township does this every year in order to have the use of equipment that does not have to be owned by the township because it is not used often enough to justify that kind of expense.
The contractors list their equipment and the rates to rent it. It has been the township's practice to accept all bids at this time of year so that when a piece of equipment is needed for a day or a job, the appropriate contractor can be called. Many to most of the local contractors work hard to keep their rates stable for as long as possible.
Anyone who wants that information can find it in the meeting minutes or make a public records request. The minutes would be more economical of money and Marie's time.
Vic made a motion to accept all the bids. Jason seconded; unanimous.
Jason asked if there was any additional old business.
John Festa: Asked about progress on the website. Jason said he had been working with Brent Simon to develop the front page and invited Brent to comment. Brent said the site is almost ready for content.
John Festa: More and more township websites have a newsletter on the website that discusses things people like to know about in the community. I got the Township magazine [Blogger: A publication of the Ohio Township Association, I believe] this month and there was a pretty good article about promoting your township. It talks about newsletters as a great way to promote the township.
John Festa, continuing: Maybe we can get some students at the high school to work on that. I would like to pursue that and give a report at the next meeting. I would like to pursue that if everyone is in agreement.
Jason: A great [good?] idea.
Vic: That's fine.
John Festa: Chris Meduri is sending a letter out to the party involved with the trailer at the school. [Note: This is one of two trailers; the auction of the other was announced in the part of the meeting in the previous post.]
[Blogger: This is the tenant who was waiting for the basement to be completed in order to set up a pre-school. One of the great criticisms of the purchase of the school was that the Trustees had no tenant. They did. But with the new township order as of the last election, she is being sent packing.]
John Festa, continuing: He (Chris) thought it would be a good idea if they got a letter from him. It is pretty blunt and to the point. I would like to save her the embarrassment of an eviction.
Vic had not received anything at this point but thought it may have been faxed to him.
John Festa gave Vic a copy.
Public Comment began at about 8:34. Jason reminded everyone that comment was to be about Township business only and that remarks should be brief, since a fair number of people had signed on for comment.
Mark Hall: To John Festa: About four weeks ago you communicated with mantuatwp.com. They have given you a response to your inquiry. With whom were you communicating? Festa did not know.
Mark: So you have no idea whom you were talking to.
Continuing: The question last time was whether the[new] full time employee would be in addition to the 2 full time and one part time employee [already on the payroll]. I believe Vic inquired about how to pay for it. The response at that time was we'll have to look at the budget.
Tonight you are talking about painting the Town Hall and records storage. When these items come up, you don't need a plan, but when it is the school, you want a cost analysis and plan. How come the difference [in approach]?
Jason: I don't think the part time was supposed to last. [Blogger's Note: No, it was not supposed to last. That hire was for someone to be on call for snow plowing during the winter. He is still working close to full time hours, having started during the winter regardless of the snow, from what I can tell. A records request for time cards would make that quite clear.]
Jason, continuing: The part time [position] is to phase out. But right now there is a strong need for [a] part time [employee]. " In addition to part time" was probably not the right word. Part time will end very soon and probably when a full time hire is brought on board. [Blogger: As USA TV channel says, "Watch what
happens."]
Jason also asked Marie for something about the budget.
Then, to Mark: Currently there is a very clear plan, just [not?--blogger's uncertainty about phrasing] which fund we want to move it out of. In Road and Bridge we have $97,000. We also have $25,000 in improving of sites [?] in road and bridge. We have $5,000 in Machinery & Equipment. We can pull from any one of those accounts and put it into salaries. We can take salaries from Road and Bridge.
I don't know why the concern about not having enough money here.
Mark: When the question came up at the last meeting, the source [of the money] was not defined. The decision was made to move ahead. Two weeks has passed and evidently you have taken a look at it.
Jason: I took a look at this two weeks ago.
Mark: Two weeks ago, [the comment was] don't know how we are going to pay for it--we will just have to find the money.
Marie: The road and bridge fund amounts can not continue for long. We have carryover. Overall you can probably hire someone this year but I can not say they could stay on for another year.
Jason: We have a service to provide for the Township and I think the Township appreciates what has been done. I have heard nothing but good comments. We pay a lot in contracted services. If we are able to have someone on a mower and two guys doing other things, we are more efficient.
The thing is it is very taxing on Brian, training . If we bring in someone for summer help, we can not just bring someone in and expect him to run it [whatever the equipment is]. Nine dollars an hour for summer help gives you that quality of help.
Vic: That $25,000 was set aside to do repair work on the salt shed, so we will have to look at that.
Someone had come in fairly late and was sitting in the front row. Things seemed pretty informal at this point, and he asked how much the hourly rate is for employees. Answer: (Jason) $12.75 plus benefits.
The newcomer commented, I don't know of anyone who would be willing to work for just a year.
Jason, to Mark: Your other question?
Mark: You summed it up. Also--are you going to take Cal's offer? I am willing to help out. That might reduce the $1900.
Jason: To address that, there is a need and we have to figure out how to address it. We can move into the building but there are a lot of things that need to be addressed.
Accessibility: I can not foresee having a public building for someone who can not go up to the second floor. We do not necessarily have to come up to full ADA, but we need to address that. There are also some costs that Cal Brant outlined--painting, floor work, moving chalk boards.
The way it was handled in the past, it was bought in 2004, and the only part being used right now is the annex--we are 8 years down the road and we only have a portion open.
[Blogger: Jason was elected 2-1/2 years ago having stated in the League of Women Voters tabloid that he would work to get us into the old Center School. Since then, he has opposed spending any money on the building, has said that he would sell the school if the price was right, and put in one short evening of work only in the gymnasium to prepare for the open house last July. If he had been as good as his campaign word, it is reasonable to think that we just might be further along than we are. I find his statement about lack of progress, given his lack of effort, to be disingenuous. And that would be a great "word for the day" to look up.]
Jason, continuing: I don't want to piecemeal but want a full cost analysis.
Mark: It is no less accessible than where the office is right now. People can come into the annex and Marie can meet them.
Jason: Marie's office is not a public establishment.
[Blogger: That's enough for now. This post is already long. The way everything unfolded at this meeting, one thing led right into another into another, and finding a place to break is a challenge. The discussion about the school will continue in the next post. In my opinion, this meeting goes a long, long way to defining very clearly what is going on in the township now--the issues, the attitudes, the stonewalling and the waffling when called to be accountable. Taken a sentence at a time, many comments from the two junior trustees sound unobjectionable and responsible. In context, the bloom goes off.]
.
Saturday, May 5, 2012
Marie Warns Trustees to be Fiscally Responsible
The posts for the May 3, 2012, Mantua Township Trustees meeting begin here. A lot was said in this meeting that will carry into the future. As it turns out, this specific post has turned into "Fact Checker at Work" in addition to reporting on the meeting.
After the meeting had been called to order and the minutes reviewed, corrected, and accepted, the usual opening procedures went on.
Frank Horack had requested [minutes of] all Trustees regular and special meetings.
Two letters from Cal Brant had been received, one requesting a date when he could begin work to get Marie into her office in the school building and the other stating that he hoped that the carpet in that room could be removed and discarded by May 12. [That date would save disposal costs by including the carpet in the Township cleanup day, when dumpsters will already be on hand.]
Cal's letters also asked for an availability date for rental and the rates, and he asked when he could get started on that project.
Marie gave each Trustee a copy of a letter to be read into the record. It follows in its entirety.
May 3, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees
Jason Carlton
John Festa
Victor Grimm
Dear Trustees,
I want to go on record that I have advised you that the township has budgeted for two full time and a part time employee, and I have told you that I do not think that the budget can handle three full time employees. We may be able to handle this for the remainder of 2012, but certainly not on a long term basis. You have been made aware on numerous occasions that the township's revenues are decreasing, and will continue to decrease as a result of both state and economic cutbacks. Salaries are paid from Gas Tax, which had a 7% reduction of revenues over the past year. Benefits are paid from Road & Bridge, which had a 3% reduction of revenues over the past year.
We have remained in good financial condition through careful management of funds. I would like to continue fiscal conservation, rather than fiscal irresponsibility, which has gotten so many other governments in Ohio into financial trouble. Ultimately, however, the final decision on spending is yours.
Marie Stehli (signed)
Fiscal Officer
Jason: It absolutely is.
Marie also stated that it is the trustees who decide how to spend the money, but the fiscal officer gets the blame.
[A note on atmosphere: When Marie said "fiscal irresponsibility," there was a snort from the back of the room in the area where Larry Leitzow was sitting. I did not look to see who may have made it--snorts are pretty brief events--but I have heard a lot of them in the last three years or so. The location didn't need visual confirmation--our ears are designed to locate sounds.]
[Blogger: This is the "Fact Checker" part. A while ago, in talking with someone about how township government works, the other person was surprised to learn that Marie did not have a vote.
The trustees make the decisions and authorize spending the money. The fiscal officer advises them, keeps the budget and the public records, and makes out the checks for the trustees to sign. The fiscal officer is audited by the State. Marie has never had a bad audit.
The fiscal officer is not an employee of the trustees, and also does not answer to them--this is defined by state law--but is an independent elected officer.
In the past, I often observed the trustees to ask Marie about the budget and then carefully figure out how to build that information into their decisions.
Appropriations are based on the budget, but as the appropriations in each fund are spent down, there will not be enough money for the rest of the year. Another approach is basically robbing Peter to pay Paul, and at some point there is not enough money to do what really needs to be done. The budget can not be increased beyond what is available--also by state law.
My apologies to those who already know all of that, but if some did not, now they do.]
Barb Herbold, Ladies Cemetery Association, announced that the tree dedication would be held on Sunday and that the weather should be good.
Nothing from either the Garden Club or the Chamber of Commerce.
Roads: Brian Tayerle announced that the asphalt roller is working again and that the plants are open. The cemetery is being marked for new foundations.
Trustee Reports began at 7:50.
Jason: The vacant trailer at the school building has been sold in an online auction for $205.
At 8:30 a.m. on Wednesday, there will be a meeting with Tim Herbst, with Terry Asphalt, and with Tony Jerome (may not have that name quite right). The purpose is to get help with a road plan and also to get more information on how a core sample may help to analyze the problems that make Pioneer Trail such a patching nightmare. These men only meet during the week during business hours.
Jason also mentioned some training classes that would be available to the road crews.
Marie: Someone else will have to take the notes for that meeting, because I have a commitment scheduled for Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday.
Jason: Said he is aware of where salaries come from and that revenues are decreasing. He thinks we can pull something from the Road and Bridge account, and we are getting an extra $60,000 for paving.
John Festa: John asked Marie how the records are being stored.
Marie: Some are in boxes, some in file cabinets, some in stacks.
John: How long is our records retention?
Marie: I have at my house only the financials.
John: 20 boxes?
Marie: Not in my house?
John Festa: To John Vechery: How many records at your house?
John Vechery: Two 4-drawer and two 2-drawer file cabinets. Some are in boxes, mostly old maps.
John Festa: I am somewhat concerned about our records and think they should be stored in a central location. I visited a facility this week that can store our records securely and economically. It is a temporary solution. I can put all of this together for our next meeting. It would be $1.50 per box plus .20 per month.
[Note, Blogger: I don't quite understand this, and it is meaningless until the number of boxes/items has been determined.
Marie: Are we talking about this when we can have storage quickly?
John Festa: Until we make a decision about what we want to do. You wrote a letter about having records near a space heater.
Vic: We have a fire proof building--the school.
John F: It is not secure.
Vic: We can make it secure and put locks on everything.
John Festa: I am not ready to make a decision on this.
I am looking at the trustees taking charge of the records and putting them in a safe location. I would like to know your thoughts (to Jason and Vic). [Blogger: My boldface.]
Jason: As far as the school, in the long term that is probably where they will end up. Short term, we are probably not prepared. A cost analysis has to take place. I have not had a chance to look at it.
I do not know the scope of our records and this is the third year of my being a trustee. [Blogger: Is that someone else's fault?] Our records are all over the township. I have heard horror stories of fires and townships losing records. [Blogger: Yes--from wooden structures like the Township Hall and the Civic Center--both of which were mentioned as possible records and office facilities.]
Vic: We have a fireproof building built in 1914 to be fireproof and it can be secure and that is where they should be.
John Festa: I want to move on. The second thing I want to discuss is t his building.
[Blogger: I am going to summarize this here.]
The building's exterior needs to be repainted; cleaning it should be done by power washing; John Festa had gotten three quotes, one of which was substantially lower. John questioned whether the paint on the shutters and cupola is historically correct [Blogger: Historical correctness, with a plastic WWII sign now displayed as a wonderful thing?].
Jason and John exchanged some discussion and Jason asked Marie about the budget.
Marie: $2500. That would take care of all of the money for the year.
Vic: I want to take a look at it for the budget.
John Festa asked when it was last painted. Answer: 2000. Vic described the process used then.
More discussion about what would be involved, including costs.
Marie: Thought this would be as good a time as any for a budget workshop.
[Note: There was no response to or acknowledgment of that suggestion.]
John Festa: Other than the Ohio Revised Code is there a policy in place for purchasing equipment and supplies? [Blogger: Eh? You mean, is there anything other than the LAW?]
Marie: We usually go with the ORC, which has been continually updated.
John Festa: Asked everyone to consider a policy so vendors, citizens, and trustees all know what we are doing as a transparency item. [To reiterate: It's the ORC. It's online.]
Marie said she would look and probably has something of her own.
[Blogger: This is enough for now. The post is long, but in my mind all the pieces of it are connected.]
After the meeting had been called to order and the minutes reviewed, corrected, and accepted, the usual opening procedures went on.
Frank Horack had requested [minutes of] all Trustees regular and special meetings.
Two letters from Cal Brant had been received, one requesting a date when he could begin work to get Marie into her office in the school building and the other stating that he hoped that the carpet in that room could be removed and discarded by May 12. [That date would save disposal costs by including the carpet in the Township cleanup day, when dumpsters will already be on hand.]
Cal's letters also asked for an availability date for rental and the rates, and he asked when he could get started on that project.
Marie gave each Trustee a copy of a letter to be read into the record. It follows in its entirety.
May 3, 2012
Mantua Township Trustees
Jason Carlton
John Festa
Victor Grimm
Dear Trustees,
I want to go on record that I have advised you that the township has budgeted for two full time and a part time employee, and I have told you that I do not think that the budget can handle three full time employees. We may be able to handle this for the remainder of 2012, but certainly not on a long term basis. You have been made aware on numerous occasions that the township's revenues are decreasing, and will continue to decrease as a result of both state and economic cutbacks. Salaries are paid from Gas Tax, which had a 7% reduction of revenues over the past year. Benefits are paid from Road & Bridge, which had a 3% reduction of revenues over the past year.
We have remained in good financial condition through careful management of funds. I would like to continue fiscal conservation, rather than fiscal irresponsibility, which has gotten so many other governments in Ohio into financial trouble. Ultimately, however, the final decision on spending is yours.
Marie Stehli (signed)
Fiscal Officer
Jason: It absolutely is.
Marie also stated that it is the trustees who decide how to spend the money, but the fiscal officer gets the blame.
[A note on atmosphere: When Marie said "fiscal irresponsibility," there was a snort from the back of the room in the area where Larry Leitzow was sitting. I did not look to see who may have made it--snorts are pretty brief events--but I have heard a lot of them in the last three years or so. The location didn't need visual confirmation--our ears are designed to locate sounds.]
[Blogger: This is the "Fact Checker" part. A while ago, in talking with someone about how township government works, the other person was surprised to learn that Marie did not have a vote.
The trustees make the decisions and authorize spending the money. The fiscal officer advises them, keeps the budget and the public records, and makes out the checks for the trustees to sign. The fiscal officer is audited by the State. Marie has never had a bad audit.
The fiscal officer is not an employee of the trustees, and also does not answer to them--this is defined by state law--but is an independent elected officer.
In the past, I often observed the trustees to ask Marie about the budget and then carefully figure out how to build that information into their decisions.
Appropriations are based on the budget, but as the appropriations in each fund are spent down, there will not be enough money for the rest of the year. Another approach is basically robbing Peter to pay Paul, and at some point there is not enough money to do what really needs to be done. The budget can not be increased beyond what is available--also by state law.
My apologies to those who already know all of that, but if some did not, now they do.]
Barb Herbold, Ladies Cemetery Association, announced that the tree dedication would be held on Sunday and that the weather should be good.
Nothing from either the Garden Club or the Chamber of Commerce.
Roads: Brian Tayerle announced that the asphalt roller is working again and that the plants are open. The cemetery is being marked for new foundations.
Trustee Reports began at 7:50.
Jason: The vacant trailer at the school building has been sold in an online auction for $205.
At 8:30 a.m. on Wednesday, there will be a meeting with Tim Herbst, with Terry Asphalt, and with Tony Jerome (may not have that name quite right). The purpose is to get help with a road plan and also to get more information on how a core sample may help to analyze the problems that make Pioneer Trail such a patching nightmare. These men only meet during the week during business hours.
Jason also mentioned some training classes that would be available to the road crews.
Marie: Someone else will have to take the notes for that meeting, because I have a commitment scheduled for Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday.
Jason: Said he is aware of where salaries come from and that revenues are decreasing. He thinks we can pull something from the Road and Bridge account, and we are getting an extra $60,000 for paving.
John Festa: John asked Marie how the records are being stored.
Marie: Some are in boxes, some in file cabinets, some in stacks.
John: How long is our records retention?
Marie: I have at my house only the financials.
John: 20 boxes?
Marie: Not in my house?
John Festa: To John Vechery: How many records at your house?
John Vechery: Two 4-drawer and two 2-drawer file cabinets. Some are in boxes, mostly old maps.
John Festa: I am somewhat concerned about our records and think they should be stored in a central location. I visited a facility this week that can store our records securely and economically. It is a temporary solution. I can put all of this together for our next meeting. It would be $1.50 per box plus .20 per month.
[Note, Blogger: I don't quite understand this, and it is meaningless until the number of boxes/items has been determined.
Marie: Are we talking about this when we can have storage quickly?
John Festa: Until we make a decision about what we want to do. You wrote a letter about having records near a space heater.
Vic: We have a fire proof building--the school.
John F: It is not secure.
Vic: We can make it secure and put locks on everything.
John Festa: I am not ready to make a decision on this.
I am looking at the trustees taking charge of the records and putting them in a safe location. I would like to know your thoughts (to Jason and Vic). [Blogger: My boldface.]
Jason: As far as the school, in the long term that is probably where they will end up. Short term, we are probably not prepared. A cost analysis has to take place. I have not had a chance to look at it.
I do not know the scope of our records and this is the third year of my being a trustee. [Blogger: Is that someone else's fault?] Our records are all over the township. I have heard horror stories of fires and townships losing records. [Blogger: Yes--from wooden structures like the Township Hall and the Civic Center--both of which were mentioned as possible records and office facilities.]
Vic: We have a fireproof building built in 1914 to be fireproof and it can be secure and that is where they should be.
John Festa: I want to move on. The second thing I want to discuss is t his building.
[Blogger: I am going to summarize this here.]
The building's exterior needs to be repainted; cleaning it should be done by power washing; John Festa had gotten three quotes, one of which was substantially lower. John questioned whether the paint on the shutters and cupola is historically correct [Blogger: Historical correctness, with a plastic WWII sign now displayed as a wonderful thing?].
Jason and John exchanged some discussion and Jason asked Marie about the budget.
Marie: $2500. That would take care of all of the money for the year.
Vic: I want to take a look at it for the budget.
John Festa asked when it was last painted. Answer: 2000. Vic described the process used then.
More discussion about what would be involved, including costs.
Marie: Thought this would be as good a time as any for a budget workshop.
[Note: There was no response to or acknowledgment of that suggestion.]
John Festa: Other than the Ohio Revised Code is there a policy in place for purchasing equipment and supplies? [Blogger: Eh? You mean, is there anything other than the LAW?]
Marie: We usually go with the ORC, which has been continually updated.
John Festa: Asked everyone to consider a policy so vendors, citizens, and trustees all know what we are doing as a transparency item. [To reiterate: It's the ORC. It's online.]
Marie said she would look and probably has something of her own.
[Blogger: This is enough for now. The post is long, but in my mind all the pieces of it are connected.]
Friday, May 4, 2012
In Memoriam: Uncle Bill
This is Dave's homage to our uncle, who died in the wee hours of Sunday morning.
Uncle Bill
From North Atlantic convoys
To the storm off Normandy's beaches
From "Halsey's Typhooon" to Great Lakes gales
To, at last, quiet harbor.
Wm. H. Pollard, Jr.
1920-2012
The "storm off Normandy's beaches" refers to horrible weather that delayed Uncle Bill's ship from reaching port in England for quite a while. Finally, they reached the harbor, where a pilot came out to the ship to guide it in. The docks were lined with many, many people, and when Uncle Bill asked about them, the pilot said, "Captain--look at your ship. We thought you were lost."
When Cal Brant was finishing my house, he met Uncle Bill and asked him about his experience and license. Uncle Bill just said four words: "All boats, all waters."
Father Garvey, whose brother sails on the Great Lakes, came to the memorial service because he said he had been hearing about this ship captain who lived in Mantua, but whom he had never met. Sailing is a powerful fraternity. Father gave me this psalm, which I think is quite beautiful.
They that go down to the sea in ships, that do business in great waters; These see the works of the LORD, and his wonders in the deep. For he commandeth, and raiseth the stormy wind, which lifteth up the waves thereof. They mount up to the heaven, they go down again to the depths: their soul is melted because of trouble. They reel to and fro, and stagger like a drunken man, and are at their wits' end. Then they cry unto the LORD in their trouble, and he bringeth them out of their distresses. He maketh the storm a calm, so that the waves thereof are still. Then are they glad because they be quiet; so he bringeth them unto their desired haven.
Psalms. 107: 23-30, KJV
Uncle Bill
From North Atlantic convoys
To the storm off Normandy's beaches
From "Halsey's Typhooon" to Great Lakes gales
To, at last, quiet harbor.
Wm. H. Pollard, Jr.
1920-2012
The "storm off Normandy's beaches" refers to horrible weather that delayed Uncle Bill's ship from reaching port in England for quite a while. Finally, they reached the harbor, where a pilot came out to the ship to guide it in. The docks were lined with many, many people, and when Uncle Bill asked about them, the pilot said, "Captain--look at your ship. We thought you were lost."
When Cal Brant was finishing my house, he met Uncle Bill and asked him about his experience and license. Uncle Bill just said four words: "All boats, all waters."
Father Garvey, whose brother sails on the Great Lakes, came to the memorial service because he said he had been hearing about this ship captain who lived in Mantua, but whom he had never met. Sailing is a powerful fraternity. Father gave me this psalm, which I think is quite beautiful.
They that go down to the sea in ships, that do business in great waters; These see the works of the LORD, and his wonders in the deep. For he commandeth, and raiseth the stormy wind, which lifteth up the waves thereof. They mount up to the heaven, they go down again to the depths: their soul is melted because of trouble. They reel to and fro, and stagger like a drunken man, and are at their wits' end. Then they cry unto the LORD in their trouble, and he bringeth them out of their distresses. He maketh the storm a calm, so that the waves thereof are still. Then are they glad because they be quiet; so he bringeth them unto their desired haven.
Psalms. 107: 23-30, KJV
Thursday, May 3, 2012
Mantua Twp. Trustees 4-19-12, Final
Foreword: This post collects a couple of things from Trustees' remarks and public comment. The blog for the April 19 meeting is certainly not a transcript, but it has made an effort to present the most significant things, in my opinion, from that meeting. I am not going to follow this format--of trying to present items from the business parts of the meeting and trustees reports in connection with the public comment that responds to those items--because it is simply too cumbersome. There are other ways to make the connections.
There was discussion about beginning the meetings at 7:15 and paying the bills first. Marie said that it would be difficult for her to make it that early.
Spring cleanup is scheduled for May 12, from 7:30-4:00. John Festa said that volunteers only needed to show up to work. Everyone who works will also have to sign a waiver. Jason said that he had gotten a call from Larry Leitzow that he has volunteered his backhoe for the day. Mike Kodash, whom we have had to pay, has usually worked that day. Jason confirmed that there would be no charge for Larry's machine; Larry will bring it and operate it. Marie said that they would want some liability on that. Larry said that he had $2 million liability insurance. Vic said that normally we need a certificate of insurance, and Larry said that he had that, interrupting Vic twice to state that he had that.
John Festa told Marie that he has a new phone number (330-274-4144).
Second, John asked Marie to send a copy of the resolution to evacuate the trailer to Chris Meduri.
He also said that he had purchased a No Admittance sign for the garage and would put it up the next day. He inquired about the panic bars on the doors at the school, and Vic said he was going to deal with that.
There was some discussion about road projects and who was to be listed as CEO (the chairperson).
Jason commented about the road from Loris Avenue to Mantua Center Road, which has been breaking up. The road is very flat and there is no place for the water to go. He wondered if it would help if they got a core sample to help decide how to deal with the situation.
Vic: Do you have any idea of the cost of testing?
Jason: I do not. There is a firm in Cortland that does that.
Vic: I guess we will hold off until the next meeting and see what the cost will be and what their recommendation is. We already have the contract set so I don't know how we would add to it. The cost is already figured into the budget.
The problem is drainage. It is flat and everything drains up to/towards the road. On the one side there is piping to the catch basins. There is some old tiling.
Jason: No catch basins.
Vic: If we can hold off until the next meeting and see what we find out.
John Festa gave his assent to that.
Marie asked for a motion.
Jason: I don't know what it is going to cost. I make a motion to explore the core sampling. If it is under a couple of thousand dollars, it is probably worth it.
John Festa: We might as well look into it.
Vic: It is mostly poor drainage.
Jason: Why don't we limit it to not to exceed $2,000.
Vic: Would that come out of contracts, Marie? Answer: We haven't spent much on contracts. Marie mentioned some numbers, and there was a little discussion about it.
Second, Festa. Unanimous.
[Blogger: What am I missing? Money is going to be spent without knowing in advance by researching the issue how much money it will cost?]
Vic mentioned fliers about the cleanup day and that the scrap tire pickup is also listed on the fliers.
Next, he mentioned a situation on Loris Avenue about drainage and a difference of opinion between two residents about that and cleanup there. There is uncertainty about whose property the catch basin is on. The Trustees will have to look into it.
Aurora Meadows is the next project on the 5-year plan, and some work still needs to be done on the west side. Some type of reconstruction of ditches has to be done. Vic asked if Jason had had a discussion with Bonner (?) about that.
Jason went back to Loris Avenue and asked whose responsibility that was.
Vic commented that the situation there affected only the two owners, but the situation at Aurora Meadows affects the whole development. What we have done in the past is to have an agreement with Mantua Township and a contractor.
Vic: One other thing. The regards the front door at the school building. The new front door is gray. I have an offer from a volunteer to paint it, free of charge, if we supply the paint. There was a surprising amount of back and forth about the color to use (the paint itself will be about $50 for a gallon). Finally Terri said "White," and instantly John Festa and Jason chose gray.
Then there was discussion about the old doors and panic bars, which may no longer meet code. Vic said they would have to check with the fire department. A motion had to be made (Vic?) to dispose of the old wooden doors at Spring Cleanup. That got a second and passed.
Then there was a list of the culvert pipe as of that day, to the best of Vic's knowledge. Some discussion about why and whether people had signed up, and the people being grandfathered in for the Township to take care of the work.
There was discussion about the cost of tires for one of the pieces of equipment, and also that Vic was still working on the EPA requirements for the dechlorinator. An ultraviolet light would actually eliminate the need for a dechlorinator and would be a one-time cost of $600. The EPA representative cannot tell how to size the light, and Vic is not sure whether it will fit into the tank. He will keep the trustees informed.
He then went to new business, which was the letter from Dawn.
After that, the website policy was discussed. Jason had only two copies, one for Marie and one for Vic and John Festa to share. It will be shown on the township website when that is up and running. There was review of various small details. Jason made a motion to enter into a design agreement with GoRilla Productions beginning 4/19/12. The motion passed.
Public Comment not already covered follows.
Mark Hall asked about the core sampling. He said that it would find nothing but gravel, and at a certain depth there were railroad ties.
He also commented on the website use policy and using information.
In regard to the building permit for the lower unit of the school, Mark asked for the trustees to look at what it would take to close [finish] the permit. Your expenses would drop if you looked at this. For the upstairs use, you can use it. You don't need to do anything but maybe run a phone line. Be careful that you do not get into project proliferation. The space only needs to be clean.
Barb Herbold: This is minor, but we need volunteers or someone to restore the arches at West Lawn. What is holding it together is only paint and rustoleum.
Phil Derthick: The job [chip and seal] that you guys did on Sheldon Road sure came through the winter looking nice, and I appreciate it. It is not full of potholes.
Cal Brant: Jason, I was happy to hear you say something about getting people into the school. John Festa, I think you are right about a plan. If you are looking at a project manager, I think I could handle that for you on a pro bono basis. I have done a lot of renovation over the years and also interested in space in the building along with other people, so if you could figure out the rent, I an a non-profit, so I qualify to rent there.
Jason: The #1 issue is the space. I think that has to be a primary concern for the township.
Cal: I think you have a lot of people interested in renting every since the school was purchased. A lot of money has been forfeited because we did not move forward. I am willing to do pro bono work to get Marie in there. I have offered this for the last years and would appreciate it if you take me up on it.
Dawn: Regarding the school, I think it would be a good time to ask for the whole community.
[Blogger: I never make an entry in my notes about when and where I speak in Public Comment unless I have written out a statement. So I will insert my remarks here and indicate how they connect with others. Earlier in the meeting, when the discussion turned to getting into the school, John Festa raised issues about access and carpeting and various other expenses that he thought would be incurred in getting in.]
Carole Pollard: I suggested that Jason and John Festa re-read or perhaps read for the first time the letter that Nick Ehlert had presented at the April 5 meeting.. (The school's possible designation on the National Register of Historic Places eliminates a number of the very expensive updates that would be required for an old building not so designated. Also, the public does not need to go to Marie's office to get records; she can bring them down to the gymnasium area.) I continued, regarding the carpet: There are perfectly good hardwood floors under those carpets, some of which are pretty worn; those floors were what were in the building when a lot of us attended school there. All that is necessary is to pull them up and discard them and clean the floors.
[Note: Sandy Bates's and Mark Hall's comments also connect with issues of expense and access. When John Festa was raising those issues/objections, there was a chorus of disagreement--those expenses were not necessary] from people in attendance.]
There was discussion about beginning the meetings at 7:15 and paying the bills first. Marie said that it would be difficult for her to make it that early.
Spring cleanup is scheduled for May 12, from 7:30-4:00. John Festa said that volunteers only needed to show up to work. Everyone who works will also have to sign a waiver. Jason said that he had gotten a call from Larry Leitzow that he has volunteered his backhoe for the day. Mike Kodash, whom we have had to pay, has usually worked that day. Jason confirmed that there would be no charge for Larry's machine; Larry will bring it and operate it. Marie said that they would want some liability on that. Larry said that he had $2 million liability insurance. Vic said that normally we need a certificate of insurance, and Larry said that he had that, interrupting Vic twice to state that he had that.
John Festa told Marie that he has a new phone number (330-274-4144).
Second, John asked Marie to send a copy of the resolution to evacuate the trailer to Chris Meduri.
He also said that he had purchased a No Admittance sign for the garage and would put it up the next day. He inquired about the panic bars on the doors at the school, and Vic said he was going to deal with that.
There was some discussion about road projects and who was to be listed as CEO (the chairperson).
Jason commented about the road from Loris Avenue to Mantua Center Road, which has been breaking up. The road is very flat and there is no place for the water to go. He wondered if it would help if they got a core sample to help decide how to deal with the situation.
Vic: Do you have any idea of the cost of testing?
Jason: I do not. There is a firm in Cortland that does that.
Vic: I guess we will hold off until the next meeting and see what the cost will be and what their recommendation is. We already have the contract set so I don't know how we would add to it. The cost is already figured into the budget.
The problem is drainage. It is flat and everything drains up to/towards the road. On the one side there is piping to the catch basins. There is some old tiling.
Jason: No catch basins.
Vic: If we can hold off until the next meeting and see what we find out.
John Festa gave his assent to that.
Marie asked for a motion.
Jason: I don't know what it is going to cost. I make a motion to explore the core sampling. If it is under a couple of thousand dollars, it is probably worth it.
John Festa: We might as well look into it.
Vic: It is mostly poor drainage.
Jason: Why don't we limit it to not to exceed $2,000.
Vic: Would that come out of contracts, Marie? Answer: We haven't spent much on contracts. Marie mentioned some numbers, and there was a little discussion about it.
Second, Festa. Unanimous.
[Blogger: What am I missing? Money is going to be spent without knowing in advance by researching the issue how much money it will cost?]
Vic mentioned fliers about the cleanup day and that the scrap tire pickup is also listed on the fliers.
Next, he mentioned a situation on Loris Avenue about drainage and a difference of opinion between two residents about that and cleanup there. There is uncertainty about whose property the catch basin is on. The Trustees will have to look into it.
Aurora Meadows is the next project on the 5-year plan, and some work still needs to be done on the west side. Some type of reconstruction of ditches has to be done. Vic asked if Jason had had a discussion with Bonner (?) about that.
Jason went back to Loris Avenue and asked whose responsibility that was.
Vic commented that the situation there affected only the two owners, but the situation at Aurora Meadows affects the whole development. What we have done in the past is to have an agreement with Mantua Township and a contractor.
Vic: One other thing. The regards the front door at the school building. The new front door is gray. I have an offer from a volunteer to paint it, free of charge, if we supply the paint. There was a surprising amount of back and forth about the color to use (the paint itself will be about $50 for a gallon). Finally Terri said "White," and instantly John Festa and Jason chose gray.
Then there was discussion about the old doors and panic bars, which may no longer meet code. Vic said they would have to check with the fire department. A motion had to be made (Vic?) to dispose of the old wooden doors at Spring Cleanup. That got a second and passed.
Then there was a list of the culvert pipe as of that day, to the best of Vic's knowledge. Some discussion about why and whether people had signed up, and the people being grandfathered in for the Township to take care of the work.
There was discussion about the cost of tires for one of the pieces of equipment, and also that Vic was still working on the EPA requirements for the dechlorinator. An ultraviolet light would actually eliminate the need for a dechlorinator and would be a one-time cost of $600. The EPA representative cannot tell how to size the light, and Vic is not sure whether it will fit into the tank. He will keep the trustees informed.
He then went to new business, which was the letter from Dawn.
After that, the website policy was discussed. Jason had only two copies, one for Marie and one for Vic and John Festa to share. It will be shown on the township website when that is up and running. There was review of various small details. Jason made a motion to enter into a design agreement with GoRilla Productions beginning 4/19/12. The motion passed.
Public Comment not already covered follows.
Mark Hall asked about the core sampling. He said that it would find nothing but gravel, and at a certain depth there were railroad ties.
He also commented on the website use policy and using information.
In regard to the building permit for the lower unit of the school, Mark asked for the trustees to look at what it would take to close [finish] the permit. Your expenses would drop if you looked at this. For the upstairs use, you can use it. You don't need to do anything but maybe run a phone line. Be careful that you do not get into project proliferation. The space only needs to be clean.
Barb Herbold: This is minor, but we need volunteers or someone to restore the arches at West Lawn. What is holding it together is only paint and rustoleum.
Phil Derthick: The job [chip and seal] that you guys did on Sheldon Road sure came through the winter looking nice, and I appreciate it. It is not full of potholes.
Cal Brant: Jason, I was happy to hear you say something about getting people into the school. John Festa, I think you are right about a plan. If you are looking at a project manager, I think I could handle that for you on a pro bono basis. I have done a lot of renovation over the years and also interested in space in the building along with other people, so if you could figure out the rent, I an a non-profit, so I qualify to rent there.
Jason: The #1 issue is the space. I think that has to be a primary concern for the township.
Cal: I think you have a lot of people interested in renting every since the school was purchased. A lot of money has been forfeited because we did not move forward. I am willing to do pro bono work to get Marie in there. I have offered this for the last years and would appreciate it if you take me up on it.
Dawn: Regarding the school, I think it would be a good time to ask for the whole community.
[Blogger: I never make an entry in my notes about when and where I speak in Public Comment unless I have written out a statement. So I will insert my remarks here and indicate how they connect with others. Earlier in the meeting, when the discussion turned to getting into the school, John Festa raised issues about access and carpeting and various other expenses that he thought would be incurred in getting in.]
Carole Pollard: I suggested that Jason and John Festa re-read or perhaps read for the first time the letter that Nick Ehlert had presented at the April 5 meeting.. (The school's possible designation on the National Register of Historic Places eliminates a number of the very expensive updates that would be required for an old building not so designated. Also, the public does not need to go to Marie's office to get records; she can bring them down to the gymnasium area.) I continued, regarding the carpet: There are perfectly good hardwood floors under those carpets, some of which are pretty worn; those floors were what were in the building when a lot of us attended school there. All that is necessary is to pull them up and discard them and clean the floors.
[Note: Sandy Bates's and Mark Hall's comments also connect with issues of expense and access. When John Festa was raising those issues/objections, there was a chorus of disagreement--those expenses were not necessary] from people in attendance.]
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