Foreword: The first part of this post is heavily condensed because it is mostly discussion and acknowledged perplexity about insurance. The best thing for someone to do who wants a more complete account is to check the Township website--mantuatownshipohio.gov--after the October 3 (this week) meeting for the official minutes.
Old Business
John Festa raised the insurance issue again.
The quotes seem to be giving a lot less for not a lot less money. . . .
[Under these circumstances, an employer--or an individual, for that matter--usually shops for a lower rate.]
I don't see how we will get a better rate. . . . We may have to increase our deductibles.
Vic: Are we going to have Brian Savage [the township's agent] come and deliver this?
John Festa: I would like to.
Some discussion followed, with some questions asked of Marie Stehli about how the fund for paying the insurance is handled.
Marie: My policy will be dropping one person off soon. . . . . We paid out less than $4,000 this year.
John Festa commented that the loss of funds from Columbus [down from a high of about $68,000 to less than (I believe) $28,000 currently] is a problem also.
Jason pointed out that a 10% contribution to the insurance premium will be made from the trustees' and fiscal officer's salaries this coming year.
[Note as of 4:37 p.m. September 30: The figures below have to be revised because the premiums have changed. I have the figures, but at this moment do not have the time to revise this information. It will be done soon--I hope by the end of the day today, which usually means by 11p.m. Stand by.]
[Jason began contributing 10% earlier this year. His policy now costs $323.35 per month. So, at $32 per month, his total contribution is $384/year. The road crew had 10% taken out of their pay starting earlier this year, but they also got a pay raise which I believe more than made up for the contribution to the premium.
[Vic's premium is at present $1,122.85/month. His monthly 10% comes to $1476 per year. Marie's premium is $2667.63 per month.(That has dropped about 10% already. It is so high because of her age and because she is on a family plan.) Marie's 10%, $267/month, comes to $3,204 per year. Compare with Jason's praised contribution of $384 per year. [This is like having steak and eggs for breakfast. The chicken has an interest in the breakfast. The steer has made a commitment to the breakfast.]
Zoning Inspector
John Festa: John Dickey, hired as part time, has been putting in full time hours to get a handle on the new job and the records and filing. He has also had some requests for public records. John Festa said that we need to get the records in order and the files together.
John Dickey is asking for an assistant just to work on records for organizing and filing, and John Festa said he would bring it before the board. John Dickey needs a lock for the door of one of the rooms used for zoning and filing and thought that perhaps even the trustees could help a bit.
Jason observed that since things are currently in boxes, finding things and learning someone else's filing system is a challenge and filling a records request can be time consuming.
Vic: There are two cabinets in the small room which is lockable. The shelving and records are there. There are two for zoning and two for the cemetery. Is that the room you are talking about?
John Festa: The little closet. Does that have a lock?
Vic: Yes.
There was some discussion about the demands of the job and the possibility of giving out information that was somehow a security issue [John Festa's term].
John Dickey is not only doing the zoning work, but is also doing the filing and updating forms--things that John Festa pointed out are not in John Dickey's job description [Blogger: but may be assumed to be part of the job. I am not sure, but some things go with the territory.]
John Festa said that John Dickey just wanted some help from the trustees to get things in order.
Vic said he had taken all of the racks and file folders over to that office that we had purchased.
John Dickey wants to put some information (FAQ's) on the township website.
John Festa then raised the question of Y Fi at the school building.
Marie: It is working for me on a limited basis.
John Festa: Do you have any information on that hot spot?
Marie: You were going to bring it over.
JF: Now the road crew is making noise about having Y Fi so they can search for parts. What are we paying for it?
Marie: Five computers are supposed to be able to get on that. Our fee right now is $54.47/month.
JF: Thinks we can get something for $29.95. He wants to get it handled by the next meeting.
New Business:
Vic: Vic had some paperwork on the 3" gun on the green. The paperwork includes a checklist of things to do for the custodianship of the gun. Vic said he needs help on the GPS coordinates because not all sources give the same coordinates. The township does not have to provide a certificate of incorporation, but must provide some proof of what we are as an entity.
Vic read the letter for custodianship of the gun. He repeated that he needed better GPS coordinates because his GPS is 4 years old and the readings from newer equipment are different now.
Update on Steve Coon, who offered to paint the township hall at no charge in exchange for the money allocated to that project being shifted to the school for work there.
Vic: Steve will be in town starting Monday and will call to see about setting up a meeting.
Jason: I will be in Arizona through Wednesday.
Vic: We will try to set up something that will fit everyone's schedule. He will bring another gentleman also.
We have a bill for the shutters. To Marie: Did you get this to either group? [The Mantua Historical Society and The Mantua Restoration Society, Inc.]
Marie: You wanted to discuss the shutters first.
Blogger: This is a stopping point. The post will resume from here so as not to interrupt the logic.
Continuing:
Vic: Mr. Byler had given us an estimate of $1280 for repairs. We had to purchase 2 new shutters for the cupola. Together, they came to $414. A year ago from Baird Brothers they were $220 each, based on 8 shutters. Mr. Byler's labor came in at $1,000.
My question is that we have pledges from the Mantua Historical Society and The Mantua Restoration Society for $800 from each group. Do you think that the township would just want to pay for the two shutters?
Jason: From the original quote, we are going to have to pay a little extra for the shutters.
Vic: So if the township would pay for these two shutters, the balance can be picked up by the two societies.
Jason: To me, I don't have a problem with that at all.
To John Festa: I have a lot of questions about the painting for Mr. Coon. [Blogger: I do not have in my notes whether Jason's comment about the painting was pointed to John Festa, and then John Festa made the remark about questions for Steve Coon, or whether it was Jason's remark.]
Blogger: Another stopping point.
Continuing:
Vic: This is for the work that has been done.
Jason: I think it would be great for the two societies to pay for that.
Vic: And for the township to pay for the two shutters.
[Marie explained how all that would work.]
Jason: Do we have to make a motion, because we don't usually get donations. [Blogger: This was not a donation, or at least was intended not to be. It was to be payment of the bill to the contractor.]
Marie: I got $100 for the phone. [After one of the interminable debates about phone service, someone more or less threw a hundred dollar bill to Marie.]
Mark: Would the contractor be billing us separately? We should be paying the contractor directly, not the township. We wanted it to be like we did with HEPA.
Vic: So you are asking Reuben Byler to bill three times.
Jason: This does not come up very often. The work was done for the township, so he billed the township. I don't know how that would work.
John Festa: We contracted with him. We are the ones obligated to pay for it because we contracted with him.
Mark: Being that we are this far down the path, let's try it the way Marie described. Ideally, it would be best for us to be billed separately. On our side, what will help is that it will be a check written to the township.
Discussion then shifted to culverts and pipe briefly.
John Festa: I called Steve Coon as well and sent him an e-mail and he did not answer.
Jason added that he had also called him, saying, I am looking forward to his returning my call and am looking forward to meeting with him..
There was discussion about lining the chip and sealed roads. Some of the roads were not going to get edge lines, and Jason pointed out that there should be a deduction for that, although the contract had been for edge and center lines.
Center School and Regional Planning update.
This was about the focus groups and arranging for them to meet at the Civic Center [why not at the school, since the topic is the school?]; there will be no charge for that.
Todd Peetz wanted to get this going as soon as possible, early in October.
John Festa inquired about having a conversation with him before the process begins; Jason thought John Festa should feel free to give Todd Peetz a call.
Nothing has been done on the Skinner Road driveway, and John Festa, lead on that, didn't think it would happen this fall. He thought he would just have to draw up a letter to send to the people who had been promised work and explaining that they had run against a wall [what wall?] and it will not be completed this year. He thought that Brian Cole's work would get done.
[Blogger: How is it that with a third person on the road crew, all of this work is still not getting done?]
Vic: To Matt Parsons: A couple of meetings ago, you brought paper work [that had apparently arrived anonymously in the mail] about a purchase order. I followed up on it. The time frame I identified was correct. Steve Oros and Dennis Jahns were working then; there were some other items. The check for that was signed by all three trustees, so everything was OK at that time. The other thing I followed up on is that Sue Skrovan did that order for either Dennis of Steve as an employee. I followed up on the Will Call because I had made another order at the same time. I followed up to see who had picked it up, and it was Brian Tayerle.
[Blogger: Here are the pieces to this, if they have gotten lost in the gaps between meetings: The tone when this was brought up the first time was insinuating, as if something underhanded had gone on. Matt got the things in the mail from an unidentified source and pursued it. He is one of the five people running for trustee.]
John Festa finally answered Sue Skrovan's questions about the planter at the ball field. Sign: $150; posts, no record, but they are less than $7.50 each at Home Depot; pavers, from some things at the garage purchased in 2009. The labor was a service from the township. We don't charge for those things; they are no different than the LCA or Garden Club work. [Blogger: See Dave Pollard's comments about that point in Public Comment.] The total was $195.94. I don't have a copy of the resolution.
Marie drew a blank on that.
John Festa thought the resolution was to put it up; the flowers were donated.
Sue: I asked about the labor because you made mention of the labor costs when we were talking about ditching.
JF: That was only materials. I hope that answers your question.
JF: The second thing I asked was about Tierney Bryant's resignation letter. He read the letter aloud for the record.
Public Comment came next, and that has already been posted. This meeting is now history, or at least, I am done with it..
Monday, September 30, 2013
Sunday, September 29, 2013
Mantua Twp. Trustees 9-19-13
Marie Stehli reported $924,836.76 in revenues. Cash balance: $797,759.88.
Various reports: Club, Committee, Departments
Zoning and cemetery--no reports.
Roads: Nothing from trustees.
Terry Nielsen was on the agenda to present a levy issue for the mental health board, Issue 3. It is a continuation, not a new tax.
Discussion and indecision about the trustees endorsing the levy, and Vic pointed out that the trustees had always maintained neutrality on issues involving money and taxes.
During this presentation and discussion, there was a steady, audible muttering of conversation from the back of the room.
[Blogger: The club and committee reports are going to be given in detail, which will clarify a later public comment about the time they consume.]
Garden Club, Sue Skrovan: The Garden Club met last night and went over our constitution and by laws and will be making some amendments. We are setting up some work dates for the beds to do cleanup and planting for some small ornamentals for some of our members who have passed. We did a little cleanup last night and have a date scheduled.
The information you [Jason] requested--our president will be forwarding something to you.
Jason: Did she specify a time frame for getting back to me?
Sue: No
Jason: But you discussed it at your meeting. Answer: Yes. I think she is planning on getting that to you.
Barb Herbold: thanked the township workers for the help in West Lawn.
Jason: It looks nice and low maintenance.
Chamber of Commerce, John Festa: The speaker was from Portage Bank about investments. He reviewed the new policy for donations and asked Marie Stehli for additions
Marie: Flu clinic. There was also talk about changing the chamber meeting to one week earlier next month to avoid Thanksgiving.
Vic: Flu shots will be on October 15 at the Civic Center from 4p.m. to 6 p.m.
The Mantua Restoration Society, Mark Hall: The most important item is that the Mantua Center School was listed on the National Register of Historic Places on September 4. [Mark handed the notification to the trustees.] Continuing: That opens the door for additional grant money.
Jason: What kind?
Mark did not have a specific answer, except that some are targeted to buildings on the National Register.
Along with that, we have two fund raisers that are ongoing. One is a coverlet featuriing buildings of the Township such as the church and town hall. We are taking pre-orders. We also have a quilt that is being raffled. [Mark described the coverlet and the quilt.] The drawing for the quilt will be November 3. We may have some extras after that. Additional information is on our website: mantuarestorationsociety.org.
John Festa: I had asked you for some information.
Mark: We can take care of that after the meeting.
John Festa: I don't remember taking a vote on allowing the committee to report at every meeting. I have not gotten enough information to make a decision. [?]
Jason: About club and committee reports: When I try to organize the agenda we have reports from various sources. We also have club and committee reports. I would like to consolidate some of this. Jim Aldrich and John Dickey[(Cemetery and Zoning, respectively] talk about their areas the first of each month. I would like to make those standard for the first meeting of each month. Frank Horack has been giving updates the first of each month. I would like to move club and committee reports to the second meeting of each month. I want to ask if the board has ideas about this. If we had all of the separate reports in one meeting, it would be a lengthy meeting. [Blogger: The meetings have been lengthy for some time; I am not sure it is because of the logjam of club and committee reports.]
John Festa was OK with that; Vic said to try it and see how it works.
Blogger: I am not sure who made the next comment]: Jason: [?] The only thing I have is that some of these committees overlap and discuss the same topics. We may want to consider doing separate reports--one month Garden Club, one month Historical Society. [Note: The Historical Society almost never makes a report, and when it has, recently, it is because the society is offering to do something to help the township--like get a number of gallons of paint free.] [Blogger: I am not sure that the yardstick of efficiency is the right standard to apply here. The clubs and committees are community organizations, a regular part of the lilfe of the township. What happens when their voices are choked off?]
Jason: I am hoping that if the different organizations report once a month, they will have substance to report. Obviously if there is something urgent, we can cover it at that time.
To the organizations: If you have something that should be given the first of the month, I can add it to the agenda. Terry Nielsen did that and so did Linda Ehlert.
Jason, on the mini excavator: Two dealers would buy the road grader from the township, one for $15,000 and the other for $20,000.
Jason then delivered the various specifications from the different companies.
Case: $65,842.
Bobcat: $59,944.44. It is apparently better at ditching. It has a deeper bucket which holds more. There is a $700 extra charge to swap to a bigger bucket. That is $700 extra, a total of $1700 vs. $1,000. The Bobcat ends up being $5807 cheaper.
Interest rates for the Bobcat are a little higher apr. For a 3-year term, with a $20,000 trade-in, the Bobcat still is a better value. [Note: The original price of the grader was $180,000. I do not know how the money was handled then; it was quite some time ago.]
There was some discussion about the most economical way to accomplish this.
Jason pointed out that it was not the salesman's offer, but one he got from the technical department.
John Festa thought it was a generous offer for the grader and said he wanted to know from Marie how the numbers come out.
At 8:04, Old Business was on the table.
Blogger: That's all for this sitting. As an additional note, however, everything from the beginning of the meeting to the end of club and committee reports--that includes my notes on Marie's report--came to about 3-1/2 pages of notes. From the end of club and committee reports to the beginning of public comment was 16-17 pages of notes. I'm trying to find where club and committee reports bollix up the works, here.
Various reports: Club, Committee, Departments
Zoning and cemetery--no reports.
Roads: Nothing from trustees.
Terry Nielsen was on the agenda to present a levy issue for the mental health board, Issue 3. It is a continuation, not a new tax.
Discussion and indecision about the trustees endorsing the levy, and Vic pointed out that the trustees had always maintained neutrality on issues involving money and taxes.
During this presentation and discussion, there was a steady, audible muttering of conversation from the back of the room.
[Blogger: The club and committee reports are going to be given in detail, which will clarify a later public comment about the time they consume.]
Garden Club, Sue Skrovan: The Garden Club met last night and went over our constitution and by laws and will be making some amendments. We are setting up some work dates for the beds to do cleanup and planting for some small ornamentals for some of our members who have passed. We did a little cleanup last night and have a date scheduled.
The information you [Jason] requested--our president will be forwarding something to you.
Jason: Did she specify a time frame for getting back to me?
Sue: No
Jason: But you discussed it at your meeting. Answer: Yes. I think she is planning on getting that to you.
Barb Herbold: thanked the township workers for the help in West Lawn.
Jason: It looks nice and low maintenance.
Chamber of Commerce, John Festa: The speaker was from Portage Bank about investments. He reviewed the new policy for donations and asked Marie Stehli for additions
Marie: Flu clinic. There was also talk about changing the chamber meeting to one week earlier next month to avoid Thanksgiving.
Vic: Flu shots will be on October 15 at the Civic Center from 4p.m. to 6 p.m.
The Mantua Restoration Society, Mark Hall: The most important item is that the Mantua Center School was listed on the National Register of Historic Places on September 4. [Mark handed the notification to the trustees.] Continuing: That opens the door for additional grant money.
Jason: What kind?
Mark did not have a specific answer, except that some are targeted to buildings on the National Register.
Along with that, we have two fund raisers that are ongoing. One is a coverlet featuriing buildings of the Township such as the church and town hall. We are taking pre-orders. We also have a quilt that is being raffled. [Mark described the coverlet and the quilt.] The drawing for the quilt will be November 3. We may have some extras after that. Additional information is on our website: mantuarestorationsociety.org.
John Festa: I had asked you for some information.
Mark: We can take care of that after the meeting.
John Festa: I don't remember taking a vote on allowing the committee to report at every meeting. I have not gotten enough information to make a decision. [?]
Jason: About club and committee reports: When I try to organize the agenda we have reports from various sources. We also have club and committee reports. I would like to consolidate some of this. Jim Aldrich and John Dickey[(Cemetery and Zoning, respectively] talk about their areas the first of each month. I would like to make those standard for the first meeting of each month. Frank Horack has been giving updates the first of each month. I would like to move club and committee reports to the second meeting of each month. I want to ask if the board has ideas about this. If we had all of the separate reports in one meeting, it would be a lengthy meeting. [Blogger: The meetings have been lengthy for some time; I am not sure it is because of the logjam of club and committee reports.]
John Festa was OK with that; Vic said to try it and see how it works.
Blogger: I am not sure who made the next comment]: Jason: [?] The only thing I have is that some of these committees overlap and discuss the same topics. We may want to consider doing separate reports--one month Garden Club, one month Historical Society. [Note: The Historical Society almost never makes a report, and when it has, recently, it is because the society is offering to do something to help the township--like get a number of gallons of paint free.] [Blogger: I am not sure that the yardstick of efficiency is the right standard to apply here. The clubs and committees are community organizations, a regular part of the lilfe of the township. What happens when their voices are choked off?]
Jason: I am hoping that if the different organizations report once a month, they will have substance to report. Obviously if there is something urgent, we can cover it at that time.
To the organizations: If you have something that should be given the first of the month, I can add it to the agenda. Terry Nielsen did that and so did Linda Ehlert.
Jason, on the mini excavator: Two dealers would buy the road grader from the township, one for $15,000 and the other for $20,000.
Jason then delivered the various specifications from the different companies.
Case: $65,842.
Bobcat: $59,944.44. It is apparently better at ditching. It has a deeper bucket which holds more. There is a $700 extra charge to swap to a bigger bucket. That is $700 extra, a total of $1700 vs. $1,000. The Bobcat ends up being $5807 cheaper.
Interest rates for the Bobcat are a little higher apr. For a 3-year term, with a $20,000 trade-in, the Bobcat still is a better value. [Note: The original price of the grader was $180,000. I do not know how the money was handled then; it was quite some time ago.]
There was some discussion about the most economical way to accomplish this.
Jason pointed out that it was not the salesman's offer, but one he got from the technical department.
John Festa thought it was a generous offer for the grader and said he wanted to know from Marie how the numbers come out.
At 8:04, Old Business was on the table.
Blogger: That's all for this sitting. As an additional note, however, everything from the beginning of the meeting to the end of club and committee reports--that includes my notes on Marie's report--came to about 3-1/2 pages of notes. From the end of club and committee reports to the beginning of public comment was 16-17 pages of notes. I'm trying to find where club and committee reports bollix up the works, here.
Saturday, September 28, 2013
Public Comment 9-19-13, Part 2. Much re school.
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: There has been a lot of discussion about what the community wants and how things change. In 2010 we had an open house and had a comment box. I am not going to read them all, but there were quite a few about a senior center. We don'[t have any place to hang out, Jason.
Comments: Beautiful building
Thank you for saving this building.
Wonderful start on renovations.
My family and I have been riding our bikes past here for years.
We live in another township but if we can help, give uis a call.
CP, resuming: There is a lot of nostalgia in this. People have roots here. The first thing an invading army does is tear down the sacred buildings. This is as close to a sacred building as we have. [Blogger: I know that churches are automatically sacred. The school has acquired that status by its connection to the whole township, unlike churches, which are connected to portions of a community rather than the whole.]
One of the things that was said was that the blackboards should be kept. This is only three years old. I will give these to all of you. You are reinventing the wheel.
Jason: How many people attended? Answer: About 300.
Jason: How many comments? Answer: About 30.
Jason: How many residents?
CP: Are you trying to chip away at this. It sounds like it.
[Blogger: At this point Jason actually was writing down figures, working out percentages, and reducing the comments to something inconsequential. Early in his term he said he lived by facts. This is absolutely the first time I have seen him do anything like establishing facts--and instead of using them to work for something, he used them as a weapon. This is, of course, my opinion. I stand by my comment that they--John Festa and Jason Carlton--are reinventing the wheel.]
Jason: We need to give this to an official organization. [It took four years to decide this?] I think some of those comments are good. I don't want to make it sound as if we are discounting them, but we have approved this.
CP: The other thing that I wanted to say--I will give you this at the end of the meeting--is that all of the studies done so far are now out of date. The 2002 analysis was to bring the building up to current standards for a school. It would have cost close to $2.6 million, so the school was discarded. The Dave Sommers study was done in 2004 before the building was on the National Register.
Any studies that are done now should take that into account.
Jason: How I can imagine this whole process going is that once we have determined what the public needs and wants are, then we can focus on the specifics. Before any work can be done, we [I?] would have to put those plans before the building department. You mentioned a sprinkler system. The building department would determine that.
[Blogger: One of the things John Festa mentioned is a sprinkler system. That requires either a water tower or city water. The first looks as if it would be exorbitantly costly. The second does not exist in the township. So. Having watched John Festa for two years about the school, I do not think it is too far fetched to believe that he is looking for anything that will "prove" that the school is impossible. And I have to say that Jason is mounting considerably less than a robust defense of the building. Actually, nearly non-existent, despite the fine verbiage and buzz words.]
CP [trying to make a little lemonade out of this]: Up until now a lot of these requirements have sounded like someone's opinion and not those of someone with the right credentials. Something that has not been mentioned is what has been done on the school and I have given it to you about three times. That needs to be taken into account because if it is not, the requests for bonds will be inaccurate.
A lot of this is whistling in the wind. It does not sound to me as if any of this has been heard.
[Blogger: If someone confrontive, like Dave or me, says it, the response is dismissive, possibly accompanied by scowls from one trustee and sneers from the observers along the wall. If someone diplomatic says it, the response is dismissive, accompanied with a smile that I have trouble accepting as genuine.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: The point constantly missed about the comments is that 1.4% were negative. Watch the national elections. With 20-30% of the vote going one way, the election is foretold. The people on record as opposing the building could not have been bothered to put their comments down.
On a separate note, a few years ago in discussions held in this building there is apparently a discrepancy in how the road crew's work is considered as a cost. Any time the road crew worked at the center school building, there was a hue and cry that it had to be be charged against the building. Now it is a service to the community. There was a call for job sheets so that their work could be related to the projects. That was the way business does it was the claim. Now that has been cast aside. You have a two-faced policy that should be corrected. If they are going to plow snow at the Center school, it should be a service or it should be charged.
I did get my answer about why the truck was in Hiram. The three of them lugged the two pages to Vic's shop from the garage [and gave it to me].
Steve Zelinski and Mr. Zullo had no comment.
Betsy Wolfe, S.R. 44: I want to tell Mark Hall that I saw the coverlet. It is beautiful. [Mark had announced during Club and Committee Reports that The Mantua Restoration Society, Inc., has a coverlet for sale by pre-order and payment showing historic buildings in Mantua Village, Mantua Township, and (I believe) Shalersville, with the Mantua Center School building in the center of it.]
I did records for the township and I always made a copy of the original and redacted key information [on the copy]. I know how to handle records and have been to the workshop. I med John Dickey and he explained what he wants to do. I am already here and would be willing tohelp. Right now, I am looking for two files/records for him.
The room where he needs the lock is the big room.
Vic: I have a lock for that and it is being changed.
Betsy: The room the cabinets are in, you cannot stand in and pull the drawers out.
Jason: Which room?
Betsy described the room, which is the east classroom. She said, I am picking up the rest of the files from Robin on Sunday [those are BZA files] and will be bringing them. We need the room.
Vic:We needed a place where we can lock it all up and that is why it all went in there [the narrow little room that had, years ago, been a kind of supply store where we could buy pencils and paper.]
Betsy: The big room just needs to have a lock on it.
Vic: I have a lock and need to have a key [made].
Dan Cozzens, Winchell Road: What is the explanation about the trip report?
Jason: Basically, Dave Pollard asked why the truck was in Hiram. It was when Brian Tayerle was coming back from getting a quote from Panny's.
DC: I knew there had to be a logical explanation.
Comments: Beautiful building
Thank you for saving this building.
Wonderful start on renovations.
My family and I have been riding our bikes past here for years.
We live in another township but if we can help, give uis a call.
CP, resuming: There is a lot of nostalgia in this. People have roots here. The first thing an invading army does is tear down the sacred buildings. This is as close to a sacred building as we have. [Blogger: I know that churches are automatically sacred. The school has acquired that status by its connection to the whole township, unlike churches, which are connected to portions of a community rather than the whole.]
One of the things that was said was that the blackboards should be kept. This is only three years old. I will give these to all of you. You are reinventing the wheel.
Jason: How many people attended? Answer: About 300.
Jason: How many comments? Answer: About 30.
Jason: How many residents?
CP: Are you trying to chip away at this. It sounds like it.
[Blogger: At this point Jason actually was writing down figures, working out percentages, and reducing the comments to something inconsequential. Early in his term he said he lived by facts. This is absolutely the first time I have seen him do anything like establishing facts--and instead of using them to work for something, he used them as a weapon. This is, of course, my opinion. I stand by my comment that they--John Festa and Jason Carlton--are reinventing the wheel.]
Jason: We need to give this to an official organization. [It took four years to decide this?] I think some of those comments are good. I don't want to make it sound as if we are discounting them, but we have approved this.
CP: The other thing that I wanted to say--I will give you this at the end of the meeting--is that all of the studies done so far are now out of date. The 2002 analysis was to bring the building up to current standards for a school. It would have cost close to $2.6 million, so the school was discarded. The Dave Sommers study was done in 2004 before the building was on the National Register.
Any studies that are done now should take that into account.
Jason: How I can imagine this whole process going is that once we have determined what the public needs and wants are, then we can focus on the specifics. Before any work can be done, we [I?] would have to put those plans before the building department. You mentioned a sprinkler system. The building department would determine that.
[Blogger: One of the things John Festa mentioned is a sprinkler system. That requires either a water tower or city water. The first looks as if it would be exorbitantly costly. The second does not exist in the township. So. Having watched John Festa for two years about the school, I do not think it is too far fetched to believe that he is looking for anything that will "prove" that the school is impossible. And I have to say that Jason is mounting considerably less than a robust defense of the building. Actually, nearly non-existent, despite the fine verbiage and buzz words.]
CP [trying to make a little lemonade out of this]: Up until now a lot of these requirements have sounded like someone's opinion and not those of someone with the right credentials. Something that has not been mentioned is what has been done on the school and I have given it to you about three times. That needs to be taken into account because if it is not, the requests for bonds will be inaccurate.
A lot of this is whistling in the wind. It does not sound to me as if any of this has been heard.
[Blogger: If someone confrontive, like Dave or me, says it, the response is dismissive, possibly accompanied by scowls from one trustee and sneers from the observers along the wall. If someone diplomatic says it, the response is dismissive, accompanied with a smile that I have trouble accepting as genuine.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: The point constantly missed about the comments is that 1.4% were negative. Watch the national elections. With 20-30% of the vote going one way, the election is foretold. The people on record as opposing the building could not have been bothered to put their comments down.
On a separate note, a few years ago in discussions held in this building there is apparently a discrepancy in how the road crew's work is considered as a cost. Any time the road crew worked at the center school building, there was a hue and cry that it had to be be charged against the building. Now it is a service to the community. There was a call for job sheets so that their work could be related to the projects. That was the way business does it was the claim. Now that has been cast aside. You have a two-faced policy that should be corrected. If they are going to plow snow at the Center school, it should be a service or it should be charged.
I did get my answer about why the truck was in Hiram. The three of them lugged the two pages to Vic's shop from the garage [and gave it to me].
Steve Zelinski and Mr. Zullo had no comment.
Betsy Wolfe, S.R. 44: I want to tell Mark Hall that I saw the coverlet. It is beautiful. [Mark had announced during Club and Committee Reports that The Mantua Restoration Society, Inc., has a coverlet for sale by pre-order and payment showing historic buildings in Mantua Village, Mantua Township, and (I believe) Shalersville, with the Mantua Center School building in the center of it.]
I did records for the township and I always made a copy of the original and redacted key information [on the copy]. I know how to handle records and have been to the workshop. I med John Dickey and he explained what he wants to do. I am already here and would be willing tohelp. Right now, I am looking for two files/records for him.
The room where he needs the lock is the big room.
Vic: I have a lock for that and it is being changed.
Betsy: The room the cabinets are in, you cannot stand in and pull the drawers out.
Jason: Which room?
Betsy described the room, which is the east classroom. She said, I am picking up the rest of the files from Robin on Sunday [those are BZA files] and will be bringing them. We need the room.
Vic:We needed a place where we can lock it all up and that is why it all went in there [the narrow little room that had, years ago, been a kind of supply store where we could buy pencils and paper.]
Betsy: The big room just needs to have a lock on it.
Vic: I have a lock and need to have a key [made].
Dan Cozzens, Winchell Road: What is the explanation about the trip report?
Jason: Basically, Dave Pollard asked why the truck was in Hiram. It was when Brian Tayerle was coming back from getting a quote from Panny's.
DC: I knew there had to be a logical explanation.
Wednesday, September 25, 2013
Public Comment, 9-19-13, Mantua Twp. Trustees
Sue Skrovan had two questions before the comments that have been set down in detail in a previous post.
They follow.
Sue: A couple of quick questions: When is Trick or Treat--has any decision been made about that?
[There was discussion, briefly. Decision: Thursday, October 31, 5-7p.m., is trick or treat time in Mantua Township. This coincides with the Village. A motion was made, seconded, and approved unanimously.
Second, a question to Marie: Do you know how many requests you have received for copies of the bills for the school?
Marie did not, offhand.
Sue--I would like to know how many people made requests.
Marie: Three. Sue: Three different people. Answer: Yes.
Mark Hall, Loris Avenue: A question on the mini excavator: Does that include a lease purchase on the trailer?
Jason: No; the trailer would be a separate purchase. It is about $4,000.
Mark: Zoning records that need to be redacted: You can not pre-redact anything because the original can not be disturbed. Before anything goes out, it needs to be reviewed to see that the right redacting is done.
Jason: We just more or less need to know what is there. [Jason talked a little about John Dickey not yet knowing actually what can be done or requested 10 years after , for example.] He is hesitant to give things out.
Mark: Now would not be a time to mess with redaction. It might be appropriate for John Dickey to get himself to a public records training class.
Vic: There is one on line, one hour for only $20.00.
Jason asked if that one was specifically for zoning.
Vic: It is through the Ohio Historical Society.
Jason: There is also one at Maplewood.
Vic thought the on-line class was a kind of jump start to records.
Barb Herbold:In regard to the LCA: our officers are Terri Resh, President; Sue Skrovan, Secretary; and Barb Herbold, Secretary. We call Sue Skrovan first when we want to have a meeting because she is so busy.
Amy Janca: I would like to thank Mr. Festa for getting us a trimmer so we could edge the bed.
Terry Nielsen: With regard to the health insurance, is there any way you could buy it through a group so you are not looking at such a small number [of people on the Township's bill]?
Vic: The group we are in now is a consortium. That is why we are with the company we are with now.
Terry: With regard to the records, they need to be electronically collated so that if you have someone who is new to the job, they can pull up the record by any key [word]. I would be happy to help set up a data base. I also want to know whether the trustees have a policy relating to records as to how long they are kept or destroyed.
[Terri went into more detail about how a cross referencing system would make things easier for anyone working with zoning records. Vic described how the difficulty at present with the records is partly because of moving 30 years' worth into a new location, trying to keep the boxes more or less straight. That last sentence is mine, mostly, not Vic's exact words, but I believe it describes the situation.]
Terri reiterated that she would be happy to offer her services.
Matt Parsons: No comment.
Dawn Pechman: I have a number of things I want to address. I want to start with Terri's offer of help--I think that is wonderful. I have offered to help to, but it has never come up [been accepted]. I know a whole lot about public records and meetings. Vic, you are wrong about having to pay for a records meeting; it is free, and I am glad that Mark Hall knows a whole lot about public records.
Vic: Dawn, I was just reading what's on the e-mail. It says $20.
Dawn: It is through the Attorney General and you don't have to pay for it.
Vic: This is what it says on the e-mail.
Dawn: Well, that's wrong too. It is the Ohio Historical Association.
[Blogger: To the best of my knowledge, there is no such entity. The Ohio Historical Society keeps an archive of public records, I believe].
And club and committee reports are running rampant--I think it seems as if the club and committee reports have been taking up more time than the trustees' business. [Blogger: I have absolutely no idea where Dawn got this idea, because it is a complete exaggeration. Complete.]
Dawn, continuing: I am glad you are working on getting that straightened out. Clubs need to do what they say. [Blogger: Here Dawn said that is something else that she does well. I am not going back to the recording to try to get that.]
It is nice that Sue mentioned [how she has been treated.] It is hard when people are nasty and rude to each other and I will go back 8 years again at a garden club meeting when I had two letters read to me. We can be a community and it begins right here at this table [the trustees' table]. If someone is out of order, tell them politely to shut up [how do you say "shut up" politely?] and it is important for this zoning stuff to be straightened out. I have offered to help but have not been able to and it is unfortunate.
Mantua Township is the worst of all the townships I have had to deal with. Communication goes both ways. Policies and procedures are important also.
[Blogger: OK, for the record: The letters Dawn refers to at a Garden Club meeting came after a long time of tolerating her behavior, and the authors of the letters stood up and read them at the meeting. They were not anonymous, they were not hate letters, and they had been a long time coming. And, if you read the post with Sue's public comments, you will remember that I mentioned something about Dawn's repaying Sue's kindness in complimenting her for helping. This is how she did it.
As for Mantua Township being the worst, you should be reminded that Dawn has gotten every request that she has paid for--to the tune of something like 8,000 to 10,000 pages.
Early in doing the blog, I did a post on public records called "Let the Sun Shine In." You might want to pull it up out of the blog archives, because it is the topic of some of the remarks in this post, and is relevant--very relevant--to some of what was said in this meeting. .
Dawn is one of the candidates for trustee in this election, by the way. Her resume is on file in the Portage County Court Records. You should check it out.]
Ellie Monroe: No comment.
[Blogger: Well, this is another time when I have enjoyed as much of this as I can stand. Carole Pollard, Dave Pollard, Betsy Wolfe, and Dan Cozzens also commented. Their remarks will be in a separate post, and then I will fill in the things from the meeting that are significant or that prompted items during public comment.]
They follow.
Sue: A couple of quick questions: When is Trick or Treat--has any decision been made about that?
[There was discussion, briefly. Decision: Thursday, October 31, 5-7p.m., is trick or treat time in Mantua Township. This coincides with the Village. A motion was made, seconded, and approved unanimously.
Second, a question to Marie: Do you know how many requests you have received for copies of the bills for the school?
Marie did not, offhand.
Sue--I would like to know how many people made requests.
Marie: Three. Sue: Three different people. Answer: Yes.
Mark Hall, Loris Avenue: A question on the mini excavator: Does that include a lease purchase on the trailer?
Jason: No; the trailer would be a separate purchase. It is about $4,000.
Mark: Zoning records that need to be redacted: You can not pre-redact anything because the original can not be disturbed. Before anything goes out, it needs to be reviewed to see that the right redacting is done.
Jason: We just more or less need to know what is there. [Jason talked a little about John Dickey not yet knowing actually what can be done or requested 10 years after , for example.] He is hesitant to give things out.
Mark: Now would not be a time to mess with redaction. It might be appropriate for John Dickey to get himself to a public records training class.
Vic: There is one on line, one hour for only $20.00.
Jason asked if that one was specifically for zoning.
Vic: It is through the Ohio Historical Society.
Jason: There is also one at Maplewood.
Vic thought the on-line class was a kind of jump start to records.
Barb Herbold:In regard to the LCA: our officers are Terri Resh, President; Sue Skrovan, Secretary; and Barb Herbold, Secretary. We call Sue Skrovan first when we want to have a meeting because she is so busy.
Amy Janca: I would like to thank Mr. Festa for getting us a trimmer so we could edge the bed.
Terry Nielsen: With regard to the health insurance, is there any way you could buy it through a group so you are not looking at such a small number [of people on the Township's bill]?
Vic: The group we are in now is a consortium. That is why we are with the company we are with now.
Terry: With regard to the records, they need to be electronically collated so that if you have someone who is new to the job, they can pull up the record by any key [word]. I would be happy to help set up a data base. I also want to know whether the trustees have a policy relating to records as to how long they are kept or destroyed.
[Terri went into more detail about how a cross referencing system would make things easier for anyone working with zoning records. Vic described how the difficulty at present with the records is partly because of moving 30 years' worth into a new location, trying to keep the boxes more or less straight. That last sentence is mine, mostly, not Vic's exact words, but I believe it describes the situation.]
Terri reiterated that she would be happy to offer her services.
Matt Parsons: No comment.
Dawn Pechman: I have a number of things I want to address. I want to start with Terri's offer of help--I think that is wonderful. I have offered to help to, but it has never come up [been accepted]. I know a whole lot about public records and meetings. Vic, you are wrong about having to pay for a records meeting; it is free, and I am glad that Mark Hall knows a whole lot about public records.
Vic: Dawn, I was just reading what's on the e-mail. It says $20.
Dawn: It is through the Attorney General and you don't have to pay for it.
Vic: This is what it says on the e-mail.
Dawn: Well, that's wrong too. It is the Ohio Historical Association.
[Blogger: To the best of my knowledge, there is no such entity. The Ohio Historical Society keeps an archive of public records, I believe].
And club and committee reports are running rampant--I think it seems as if the club and committee reports have been taking up more time than the trustees' business. [Blogger: I have absolutely no idea where Dawn got this idea, because it is a complete exaggeration. Complete.]
Dawn, continuing: I am glad you are working on getting that straightened out. Clubs need to do what they say. [Blogger: Here Dawn said that is something else that she does well. I am not going back to the recording to try to get that.]
It is nice that Sue mentioned [how she has been treated.] It is hard when people are nasty and rude to each other and I will go back 8 years again at a garden club meeting when I had two letters read to me. We can be a community and it begins right here at this table [the trustees' table]. If someone is out of order, tell them politely to shut up [how do you say "shut up" politely?] and it is important for this zoning stuff to be straightened out. I have offered to help but have not been able to and it is unfortunate.
Mantua Township is the worst of all the townships I have had to deal with. Communication goes both ways. Policies and procedures are important also.
[Blogger: OK, for the record: The letters Dawn refers to at a Garden Club meeting came after a long time of tolerating her behavior, and the authors of the letters stood up and read them at the meeting. They were not anonymous, they were not hate letters, and they had been a long time coming. And, if you read the post with Sue's public comments, you will remember that I mentioned something about Dawn's repaying Sue's kindness in complimenting her for helping. This is how she did it.
As for Mantua Township being the worst, you should be reminded that Dawn has gotten every request that she has paid for--to the tune of something like 8,000 to 10,000 pages.
Early in doing the blog, I did a post on public records called "Let the Sun Shine In." You might want to pull it up out of the blog archives, because it is the topic of some of the remarks in this post, and is relevant--very relevant--to some of what was said in this meeting. .
Dawn is one of the candidates for trustee in this election, by the way. Her resume is on file in the Portage County Court Records. You should check it out.]
Ellie Monroe: No comment.
[Blogger: Well, this is another time when I have enjoyed as much of this as I can stand. Carole Pollard, Dave Pollard, Betsy Wolfe, and Dan Cozzens also commented. Their remarks will be in a separate post, and then I will fill in the things from the meeting that are significant or that prompted items during public comment.]
Tuesday, September 24, 2013
The Underbelly
Underbelly: A vulnerable area; also, a corrupt or sordid part.
Thus spake Webster. I couldn't have said it better myself. In Mantua Township since the 2009 election, the underbelly has become very prominent and has tainted many of the township's civic activities.
It began with an anonymous letter after the 2009 election that was mailed out to a great many residents, slurring Vic and Sue, alleging that the township was run by trustees taking care of the good old boys, and on and on. It was a page long. Interestingly, neither Dave nor I got one--probably because our positions were clear enough for the sickos who wrote and sent the letter to know that we would not have been influenced or impressed.
The letter was sickening because it struck at something precious to the recipient(s) with the intention of dirtying it. Vic and Sue seem particularly to get attention from these wretches--or this wretch. The letters all follow the same pattern: kick the recipient in the gut with a vicious shot at something of great personal value and then pile on a bunch of insults. The pattern suggests that they are all written by the same twisted, psychologically crippled creature . Or a committee equally misshapen.
Others followed. Seven of us--in addition to Vic and Mark--worked like galley slaves to get ready for the Open House at the school in the summer of 2010. Just before the event, five of us got anonymous letters which slurred Dave's and my mother and closed with a bogus name that pointed at someone who had been friends with Dave since childhood. So look at it: A two-fer: An ugly slur on a woman who had been dead for nearly 15 years, and an insinuation that a friend was not really a friend. One more would have been a trifecta of slander.
I called everyone in the little group and discovered that two had been spared. What was the difference between us?
The Aha!: Each recipient had criticized Jason. One gave the Rogue Website its name. The ones who did not receive letters had not criticized the then brand new trustee. Who would be stung by that perceived affront? The field of suspects just shrank to very low single digits, didn't it?
Since then, speaking up--exercising one of our fundamental rights, the one that sets us apart from Africa, the Middle East, China, and mob organizations everywhere--is the way to guarantee an attack aimed at silencing us. Dave's limericks have been a particular target, and I was shocked when he told me that he had gotten more than one hate letter before 2009 which were unprintable partly because other people were also tagged in what he received.
I got a letter of my very own about a year and a half or so ago, and I laughed when I read it. The opening shot was that my brains and education didn't amount to much because I was essentially on Vic's side. Just to be really clear, I was also on Steve Oros's side and on Mark Hall's. Integrity matters to me. Of course I was or am on the side of such people. News flash: Anyone who wants to kick me in the gut will have to try something besides my mind and what it has accomplished.. Could I end up in a nursing home with Alzheimer's? Sure. But not yet and not for the foreseeable future. The people writing the hate letters may end up there first, and much younger--hate really does eat out your brain and damage your whole body.. ("My" letter also had a close shifting apparent responsibility to someone else.)
One person said that there was an increase in the trash on the lawn following any meeting in which s/he had spoken up--and that there was more to it than trash. Something odd looking in the lawn turned out, upon checking, to be a stake driven in with just enough left above ground to seriously damage the riding mower.
And those two houses that got egged and manured? First, it did happen, one in broad daylight because as nearly as we can tell, the "perp" could either observe when the house was vacated for the day or was tipped off when the homeowner left for work.
Second, a sheriff's report was filed, but the sheriff's office occasionally turns into a black hole that swallows reports and then renders them incognito when they are requested. I have had that experience, as have others.
As for the completely flamingly bogus idea that Dave did it because he has eggs and manure, what were those fools smoking when they came up with that one? Drive down any road in the township, and you will find signs selling eggs. As for the manure, if you have a dog, then you, too--including the accusers--could be a suspect because you have access to manure.
One more thing: Dave and I, among many other mentally sound people with a conscience, are friends with the people whose houses were attacked. Now, then. Take note:
We don't attack our friends.
We don't commit vandalism.
We don't pick up feces and carry them around to attack people with.
Our parents saw to it that we knew better on all counts. Too bad whoever threw the eggs didn't have the same upbringing. Or, worse, they got an upbringing that led them to think that such behavior was all right.
Not since we left the trees to walk upright, it hasn't .
Cries of outrage are sources of mocking laughter on the part of the people doing these things.
Action is another matter. On July 20, 2013, I saw a cartoon depicting Vic as a bandit making off with Township funds. That ugly lie was what decided me to run for office. The township's funds have been reduced--but it isn't Vic who has done it.
Obviously, everyone isn't cut out to enter public life, especially not in this needlessly ugly climate, the outward expression of people whose lives are founded on nothing legitimate.
But we are all part of civic life--which means that we have the great privilege of voting our conscience. Remember: We vote privately, and our vote belongs to US, not to someone who did us a favor once and now is demanding payment for what we thought was an act of generosity.
One of my favorite quotes is "By the work, you know the workman." Everything we create in the outer world reveals the truth of what we are on the inside. What it is, we are, and it can't be hidden..
Food for thought.
Thus spake Webster. I couldn't have said it better myself. In Mantua Township since the 2009 election, the underbelly has become very prominent and has tainted many of the township's civic activities.
It began with an anonymous letter after the 2009 election that was mailed out to a great many residents, slurring Vic and Sue, alleging that the township was run by trustees taking care of the good old boys, and on and on. It was a page long. Interestingly, neither Dave nor I got one--probably because our positions were clear enough for the sickos who wrote and sent the letter to know that we would not have been influenced or impressed.
The letter was sickening because it struck at something precious to the recipient(s) with the intention of dirtying it. Vic and Sue seem particularly to get attention from these wretches--or this wretch. The letters all follow the same pattern: kick the recipient in the gut with a vicious shot at something of great personal value and then pile on a bunch of insults. The pattern suggests that they are all written by the same twisted, psychologically crippled creature . Or a committee equally misshapen.
Others followed. Seven of us--in addition to Vic and Mark--worked like galley slaves to get ready for the Open House at the school in the summer of 2010. Just before the event, five of us got anonymous letters which slurred Dave's and my mother and closed with a bogus name that pointed at someone who had been friends with Dave since childhood. So look at it: A two-fer: An ugly slur on a woman who had been dead for nearly 15 years, and an insinuation that a friend was not really a friend. One more would have been a trifecta of slander.
I called everyone in the little group and discovered that two had been spared. What was the difference between us?
The Aha!: Each recipient had criticized Jason. One gave the Rogue Website its name. The ones who did not receive letters had not criticized the then brand new trustee. Who would be stung by that perceived affront? The field of suspects just shrank to very low single digits, didn't it?
Since then, speaking up--exercising one of our fundamental rights, the one that sets us apart from Africa, the Middle East, China, and mob organizations everywhere--is the way to guarantee an attack aimed at silencing us. Dave's limericks have been a particular target, and I was shocked when he told me that he had gotten more than one hate letter before 2009 which were unprintable partly because other people were also tagged in what he received.
I got a letter of my very own about a year and a half or so ago, and I laughed when I read it. The opening shot was that my brains and education didn't amount to much because I was essentially on Vic's side. Just to be really clear, I was also on Steve Oros's side and on Mark Hall's. Integrity matters to me. Of course I was or am on the side of such people. News flash: Anyone who wants to kick me in the gut will have to try something besides my mind and what it has accomplished.. Could I end up in a nursing home with Alzheimer's? Sure. But not yet and not for the foreseeable future. The people writing the hate letters may end up there first, and much younger--hate really does eat out your brain and damage your whole body.. ("My" letter also had a close shifting apparent responsibility to someone else.)
One person said that there was an increase in the trash on the lawn following any meeting in which s/he had spoken up--and that there was more to it than trash. Something odd looking in the lawn turned out, upon checking, to be a stake driven in with just enough left above ground to seriously damage the riding mower.
And those two houses that got egged and manured? First, it did happen, one in broad daylight because as nearly as we can tell, the "perp" could either observe when the house was vacated for the day or was tipped off when the homeowner left for work.
Second, a sheriff's report was filed, but the sheriff's office occasionally turns into a black hole that swallows reports and then renders them incognito when they are requested. I have had that experience, as have others.
As for the completely flamingly bogus idea that Dave did it because he has eggs and manure, what were those fools smoking when they came up with that one? Drive down any road in the township, and you will find signs selling eggs. As for the manure, if you have a dog, then you, too--including the accusers--could be a suspect because you have access to manure.
One more thing: Dave and I, among many other mentally sound people with a conscience, are friends with the people whose houses were attacked. Now, then. Take note:
We don't attack our friends.
We don't commit vandalism.
We don't pick up feces and carry them around to attack people with.
Our parents saw to it that we knew better on all counts. Too bad whoever threw the eggs didn't have the same upbringing. Or, worse, they got an upbringing that led them to think that such behavior was all right.
Not since we left the trees to walk upright, it hasn't .
Cries of outrage are sources of mocking laughter on the part of the people doing these things.
Action is another matter. On July 20, 2013, I saw a cartoon depicting Vic as a bandit making off with Township funds. That ugly lie was what decided me to run for office. The township's funds have been reduced--but it isn't Vic who has done it.
Obviously, everyone isn't cut out to enter public life, especially not in this needlessly ugly climate, the outward expression of people whose lives are founded on nothing legitimate.
But we are all part of civic life--which means that we have the great privilege of voting our conscience. Remember: We vote privately, and our vote belongs to US, not to someone who did us a favor once and now is demanding payment for what we thought was an act of generosity.
One of my favorite quotes is "By the work, you know the workman." Everything we create in the outer world reveals the truth of what we are on the inside. What it is, we are, and it can't be hidden..
Food for thought.
Monday, September 23, 2013
9-19-13 Trustees: Sue Skrovan, Public Comment
[Blogger Foreword: Sue raised several questions and issues. This part of her remarks came at the end of what she said, but is particularly apropos, in light of recent events and commentary. I think you will see why as you read through this post.]
Note: 8:07 a.m. Tuesday, 9/24: This post was entered late on 9/23. I have not yet listened to the recording to see if something I could not write fast enough to get verbatim needs to be augmented or revised. When that has been done, this note will be changed to reflect the review.
Note: 8:30p.m. 9/25: Having reviewed Sue's remarks on the recording, everything of substance has been included already.
Sue Skrovan: The last thing: A comment about after the last meeting. This is about the questions raised to me and the Garden Club and the work we do. I have put together a list of what I have done.
Organizations:
Member, Mantua Center Garden Club
Member, Ladies' Cemetery Association
Member, Mantua Restoration Society, Inc.
Volunteer Activities:
Spring Cleanup
Plant flowers in Townhall bed
Plant flowers in Historical Marker bed
Plant flowers in Civic Center bed
Up until this year (2013), plant flowers at the Park sign
Pick up plants needed for above beds
Clean at Mantua Center School building
Weed at Mantua Center School building
Take pictures of events, including Memorial Day Parade, Cemetery, Township dinner. Spring/tire cleanup, Township projects and events.
Set up/clean up for Township Dinners and Christmas luncheons
Have, in past, taken meeting minutes in Marie's absence.
In past, prepped and planted Township's hanging baskets.
Processed, labeled, and did layout of Township's Fair board including, at times, delivering and picking up the Board at the Fair.
I have been ridiculed and things said about me and things on the public website. Letters have anonymously been sent, even [something] in the paper. All for volunteering and giving of my time. I could go on for a long time.
I would hope that the next time any of the trustees get a call anonymously complaining about something that looks bad in this township that the trustees support the clubs and the people who volunteer and tell the caller to lend a hand. No one can keep up with the weeds. The Garden Club will do their best, but I would hope that people would be told to give a hand.
Sue thanked Dawn Pechman for lending a hand at the beds after the last Garden Club meeting. [Blogger: Later, in Dawn's remarks, you will be able to see Dawn's gratitude for Sue's acknowledgment.]
Jason responded at length, but nowhere did he specifically acknowledge Sue or recognize her years of contribution to the township. To wit:
I don't think I was singling any one person out. I appreciate any act of volunteering in any form. [A general, catchall remark that could apply to anyone or no one.]What I was simply stating is that simply the flower bed at the flagpole is becoming overgrown. In the past Terri Vechery [another example of throwing someone under the bus who is not present] said that they were getting a bit older and it was getting tough to manage.
What we need as trustees is an expectation. When we work with the LCA [Jason is referring to two people, not the whole organization], it sees like a good relationship. They call us every two weeks. I think as a board we are under the assumption that the beds should be maintained a little closer by the Garden Club and if that is not the case, it [the board] should know that. We want to work in conjunction with the Garden Club, road crew, and trustees. We want to know about how it can be maintained.
Sue: This is township property and should be maintained.
Jason: It is the center of our township and a lot of traffic goes down there.
Sue: Maybe the folks complaining should help out. We have not called the garage because we have felt that the garage had better things to do. We typically don't call to ask if they can come out and help us with the weeding.
Continuing: I do not feel that one phone call should have raised all the questions it did.
Jason: A lot of it is my observation also.
[Blogger: Jason's comments pretty much had to be included with Sue's, but it is what she said that I want to build upon. What is interesting here is that he has focused on his own purposes only, without acknowledging the pain that Sue has experienced, which was evident in her voice and should have been clear, since she was sitting directly in front of the trustees' table.]. Italicized text added 9/24.
I know what was in at least one of the anonymous letters Sue received, because five of us got the same letter, each without a signature.
I have seen the most recent anonymous message to Sue, or about her. It is sexually obscene. This is the kind of thing that began as if a switch had been flipped after the 2009 election.
You do the math to see who ran and who was going to run then.
This is what most residents do not know about. They see a beautiful, still-rural township and are glad to live here where it is so peaceful. The people I have met in the last month would have been appalled and sickened by the knowledge that such a hateful thing had been delivered to Sue. They would like to believe that it is beautiful in every aspect.
So would I, but it is not. Marie's letter to the Record Courier, posted in its original entirety in the blog, was dead on as far as it went. What Marie listed was only a small part of what has been visited upon certain people in the Township over the past several years. As Billy Mays used to say, "But wait! There's more!." It deserves its own post.
Thanks for reading this.]
Note: 8:07 a.m. Tuesday, 9/24: This post was entered late on 9/23. I have not yet listened to the recording to see if something I could not write fast enough to get verbatim needs to be augmented or revised. When that has been done, this note will be changed to reflect the review.
Note: 8:30p.m. 9/25: Having reviewed Sue's remarks on the recording, everything of substance has been included already.
Sue Skrovan: The last thing: A comment about after the last meeting. This is about the questions raised to me and the Garden Club and the work we do. I have put together a list of what I have done.
Organizations:
Member, Mantua Center Garden Club
Member, Ladies' Cemetery Association
Member, Mantua Restoration Society, Inc.
Volunteer Activities:
Spring Cleanup
Plant flowers in Townhall bed
Plant flowers in Historical Marker bed
Plant flowers in Civic Center bed
Up until this year (2013), plant flowers at the Park sign
Pick up plants needed for above beds
Clean at Mantua Center School building
Weed at Mantua Center School building
Take pictures of events, including Memorial Day Parade, Cemetery, Township dinner. Spring/tire cleanup, Township projects and events.
Set up/clean up for Township Dinners and Christmas luncheons
Have, in past, taken meeting minutes in Marie's absence.
In past, prepped and planted Township's hanging baskets.
Processed, labeled, and did layout of Township's Fair board including, at times, delivering and picking up the Board at the Fair.
I have been ridiculed and things said about me and things on the public website. Letters have anonymously been sent, even [something] in the paper. All for volunteering and giving of my time. I could go on for a long time.
I would hope that the next time any of the trustees get a call anonymously complaining about something that looks bad in this township that the trustees support the clubs and the people who volunteer and tell the caller to lend a hand. No one can keep up with the weeds. The Garden Club will do their best, but I would hope that people would be told to give a hand.
Sue thanked Dawn Pechman for lending a hand at the beds after the last Garden Club meeting. [Blogger: Later, in Dawn's remarks, you will be able to see Dawn's gratitude for Sue's acknowledgment.]
Jason responded at length, but nowhere did he specifically acknowledge Sue or recognize her years of contribution to the township. To wit:
I don't think I was singling any one person out. I appreciate any act of volunteering in any form. [A general, catchall remark that could apply to anyone or no one.]What I was simply stating is that simply the flower bed at the flagpole is becoming overgrown. In the past Terri Vechery [another example of throwing someone under the bus who is not present] said that they were getting a bit older and it was getting tough to manage.
What we need as trustees is an expectation. When we work with the LCA [Jason is referring to two people, not the whole organization], it sees like a good relationship. They call us every two weeks. I think as a board we are under the assumption that the beds should be maintained a little closer by the Garden Club and if that is not the case, it [the board] should know that. We want to work in conjunction with the Garden Club, road crew, and trustees. We want to know about how it can be maintained.
Sue: This is township property and should be maintained.
Jason: It is the center of our township and a lot of traffic goes down there.
Sue: Maybe the folks complaining should help out. We have not called the garage because we have felt that the garage had better things to do. We typically don't call to ask if they can come out and help us with the weeding.
Continuing: I do not feel that one phone call should have raised all the questions it did.
Jason: A lot of it is my observation also.
[Blogger: Jason's comments pretty much had to be included with Sue's, but it is what she said that I want to build upon. What is interesting here is that he has focused on his own purposes only, without acknowledging the pain that Sue has experienced, which was evident in her voice and should have been clear, since she was sitting directly in front of the trustees' table.]. Italicized text added 9/24.
I know what was in at least one of the anonymous letters Sue received, because five of us got the same letter, each without a signature.
I have seen the most recent anonymous message to Sue, or about her. It is sexually obscene. This is the kind of thing that began as if a switch had been flipped after the 2009 election.
You do the math to see who ran and who was going to run then.
This is what most residents do not know about. They see a beautiful, still-rural township and are glad to live here where it is so peaceful. The people I have met in the last month would have been appalled and sickened by the knowledge that such a hateful thing had been delivered to Sue. They would like to believe that it is beautiful in every aspect.
So would I, but it is not. Marie's letter to the Record Courier, posted in its original entirety in the blog, was dead on as far as it went. What Marie listed was only a small part of what has been visited upon certain people in the Township over the past several years. As Billy Mays used to say, "But wait! There's more!." It deserves its own post.
Thanks for reading this.]
Saturday, September 21, 2013
Protect your vote
Marie's letter raised some crucial points. What makes our system work is several things. First, as Marie pointed out, is the Constitution.
Second is the principle of openness. We have enormous access to records of all kinds that show us who we are dealing with and what they are doing. We should use that access to learn who we are dealing with whenever possible and necessary.
Third is our vote, protected officially by the Bill of Rights, but also informally by each of us voting--which is how we create and maintain our government.
Fourth, and most important of all, is that how we vote is nobody else's flaming business. No one has any business asking how we voted or how we intend to vote. And you are not obligated to tell them.
That part is serious stuff. I asked some questions of the Board of Elections, which is not an enforcing body of any kind. If they don't, who does? Who protects this precious right? About the time I was getting really frustrated at hearing all the things the BoE doesn't or can't do, the person on the other end of the phone line delivered a bonanza.
If anyone feels pressured or intimidated into voting a certain way or posting unwanted signs, that person should file a sheriff's report. That establishes a pattern. If everyone who feels that way files such a report, then something can be done.. And since you were probably sitting across the kitchen table from the threatening person, his or her identity will be on record. The kind of person who would resort to intimidation of others would probably prefer not to be known--as is the case with most cowardly intimidators. The BoE staff member told me that a similar problem had arisen in Ravenna several years ago--and that it was stopped.
I think that in Ravenna there were fines, and someone may have gone to jail. I should not be quoted on that. Regardless of what else happened, there was certainly bad publicity.
If you vote the way the bully pushes you to do, then essentially you have voted for corruption of the kind that riddled Cuyahoga County not very long ago. Your informed, freely cast vote is the clean, sharp knife that keeps government at every level as honest as possible. In a township, that should be absolute honesty.
Protect that clean knife and use it as wisely as you can by getting your own good information (not someone else's agenda-driven opinion) and then voting accordingly--and secretly..
Second is the principle of openness. We have enormous access to records of all kinds that show us who we are dealing with and what they are doing. We should use that access to learn who we are dealing with whenever possible and necessary.
Third is our vote, protected officially by the Bill of Rights, but also informally by each of us voting--which is how we create and maintain our government.
Fourth, and most important of all, is that how we vote is nobody else's flaming business. No one has any business asking how we voted or how we intend to vote. And you are not obligated to tell them.
That part is serious stuff. I asked some questions of the Board of Elections, which is not an enforcing body of any kind. If they don't, who does? Who protects this precious right? About the time I was getting really frustrated at hearing all the things the BoE doesn't or can't do, the person on the other end of the phone line delivered a bonanza.
If anyone feels pressured or intimidated into voting a certain way or posting unwanted signs, that person should file a sheriff's report. That establishes a pattern. If everyone who feels that way files such a report, then something can be done.. And since you were probably sitting across the kitchen table from the threatening person, his or her identity will be on record. The kind of person who would resort to intimidation of others would probably prefer not to be known--as is the case with most cowardly intimidators. The BoE staff member told me that a similar problem had arisen in Ravenna several years ago--and that it was stopped.
I think that in Ravenna there were fines, and someone may have gone to jail. I should not be quoted on that. Regardless of what else happened, there was certainly bad publicity.
If you vote the way the bully pushes you to do, then essentially you have voted for corruption of the kind that riddled Cuyahoga County not very long ago. Your informed, freely cast vote is the clean, sharp knife that keeps government at every level as honest as possible. In a township, that should be absolute honesty.
Protect that clean knife and use it as wisely as you can by getting your own good information (not someone else's agenda-driven opinion) and then voting accordingly--and secretly..
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)