Public Comment: Almost everyone who signed in for the meeting also signed in for public comment.
Bill Kelley was first on the list but said he had already said what he wanted to.
Kathy Kelley, School Lane: I just want to reiterate regarding School Lane we would like to have the three owners of 11701 who think they own School Lane officially notified that they do not own it. Also, have the No Trespassing signs in front of our house removed.
Jason: [This is] two-pronged. The signs, John Dickey. I will have a discussion with him, and he can have the signs removed and notify the owner. They are not political signs, which can not be touched, but these are not political and they can not be in the right of way.
Vic: I will get something drafted up to notify them where the right of way [is] and notify them. [Two of the owners live on Loris Drive, James and Connie Goggin. Colleen Heineman is their daughter and is also listed on the deed. She and her husband live at 11701 School Lane.
Jason: For some of the new folks, I can understand some of the confusion. In some roads you pay taxes to the middle of the road, and so some people might think they own to the middle.
Bill Kelley: We were threatened with a road closure that threatened our home access and property. The township and community and mail carrier and voters would all be affected.
Kathy Kelley: On June 19, James Goggin went to Ravenna and paid the first and second half of 2016 [taxes] and whatever else had to be paid. Therefore he thought he bought the road. That is the date he came and told us he had purchased the road.
Vic: Another confusing thing for the whole county is the aerial GIS.
Jason: It can be off.
[Blogger: I do not have a note about whether Jason or Vic made the next comment]: The county office told me that it is not surveyable. The only thing that is surveyable is the last transfer of the deed.
Jason: I will contact John Dickey tomorrow about the signs and the fence [?] and have him draft up something ASAP. As far as the property line, you seem to have a bead on that, Vic, and as soon as you have something, we can sign it.
To Kathy: Give us a few days. We are working on it.
Mark Hall, Loris Drive: The question on the proposal for the Weber [?] property: I understand the service property. [?] What happens after 5 years?
John Festa: It gets renegotiated. And it is the Taylor property.
Sue Skrovan, Wayne Road: Two quick things. For the Garden Club, I neglected to thank people who had donated plants. One was Amy Janca. Also, Shirley Ferris and Wendolyn [Taylor, I believe, blogger's guess] brought plants. The only other thing is that the property between the 12-holer and the church--is that part of township parking, or is it owned by the church?
Vic: Part of it is theirs and part is the township.
Sue: The Garden Club has a lot of issues with the thistle. It keeps getting into the gravel [on the side of the township hall]. I don't know if the road crew can spray it.
At that point, Amy Janca, who had passed on public comment, joined in. She confirmed that the thistle was bad.
Sue: I don't know if I thanked the township for pulling up the grass that had been there. We tried to get it out but we couldn't. We are going to get rings to contain annuals. As pretty as the grass is, it still causes problems.
Matt Parsons, Wayne Road: To John Festa: If you need any help with the driver's handbook, I would help you with that--give you help based on my professional work.
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: First, this is going to sound goofy, but there is a potential safety/visibility problem for the road crew. There are conditions in which the safety green on their shirts is almost invisible. The road crew needs to be careful because the green blends in. The day-glo orange always shows up.
Second, this will sound biased. Susan [Dave's wife] is very happy that the food was so well received at the flea market. I have never seen her so tired as she was Friday night. Mark Hall's wife added an excellent pasta salad. The rest of it Susan made. She was thrilled tolearn how well we did.
Do you have any idea how long Mantua Center Road will be closed?
Jason: At least . . . . [Blogger: An odd squiggle in my notes may be 2--as in 2 years.]
Vic: The first thing is they have to evaluate the bridge and then they can apply for the money, and that will be April, and then it will be a year before we can get the money.
Jason: And that is if we are high on the list.
[He explained about what happened and how much the township did not know about what the County was doing.]
Continuing: We got a notice that the bridge was closed. Brian Tayerle knew nothing about that, and by the time he got there, signs had been posted and railings and mounds had been put up.
Dave: About the license: Does it transfer?
John Festa: She could assign it to whoever she wants.
Dave: If the ownership changes, will you renegotiate then?
John Festa: If it is for the previous occupant . . . . I am doing this as a courtesy for Mrs. Taylor.
Dave: Let's say the Webers buy it and 3 years from signing an agreement they will sell the property. Would they [be able] to renegotiate?
John Festa: Why are you concerned about something that you don't own?
Dave: We haven't had a problem with the road crew but I am concerned about it. It took long enough.
John Festa: Will it transfer to someone, no, probably not.
Dave: Most people who live here know that they own to the middle of the road under the road. If the road is vacated, people can then begin using the land that has been vacated.
Jan Oros, to Dave and then apparently to John Festa: Yes, after quite a long time you came to this point which I think could have been come to right at the beginning with due diligence and neighborliness.
I have never seen the bullpen look like that, ever. I am holding my response. [Blogger: That is what my notes transcribe into. I believe that Jan was saying she was holding her thoughts in check to a certain extent.]
[Blogger: Recently a long-time resident contacted me about something and in no uncertain terms voiced an opinion about how beautiful the bullpen is NOT.]
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: [Before keyboarding my remarks, let me say that they are not word for word, but the content is OK. There was a lot of noise, and I was surprised at how difficult it was, even with the volume turned up, to make out every word. I will interpret or comment where it seems necessary.]
How many lawsuits are we involved in right now with zoning?
Jason thought out loud and finally allowed as how it was three and then named them. He also questioned the term "lawsuit."
CP: How many involve talking with lawyers?
Jason: Three.
CP: Why is it that someone who probably knows said there are seven?
Jason quibbled about that, and somewhere in this whole exchange cast doubts on hearsay. Then: You can go to court records and look up Mantua Township . . . .
CP: Jason, I know how to use court records. Your answer is interesting.
Jason: The reason there is three is that some of these have been going on for 2-3 years. I don't know where you got 7.
John Festa added something about only one person against us, if my notes are correct. To be honest, that's open to question on this item, given the difficulty of getting clear audio.
CP: I thought [your answer] was interesting. I know we don't have to pay Chris Meduri's salary. I'm just curious about how many hours it would be if we had to pay for it.
[Jason dismissed that idea, since we don't have to pay for our legal counsel.]
CP, continuing: It seems as if we are involved in all this stuff which strikes me as what happens when you get aggressive with how to deal with people. I have heard 7 from a couple of places and one seemed to consider it a source of pride that we had that much going on against our residents.
I just don't think that is quite how you ought to be doing things. I know that John Vechery got criticism from people who thought he was lazy, but it may simply be that he was easy with people. It seems to me like a good thing under the circumstances.
[Somewhere in this exchange with Jason, two things happened. First, he turned to John Festa but not to Vic for confirmation about what's going on with legal disagreements regarding zoning. Second, as you, dear reader, might imagine, Jason did not like the direction of the exchange and bridled at it. I said, "I wanted to see if you're on top of it."]
Continuing: The other thing I wanted to say is to thank whoever mowed on Allyn Road for avoiding cutting down the milkweed at the end of my driveway.
Jason: You may hear 7, but that is not true. It doesn't seem to be true. I don't know where you got the number. We do bounce a lot of things off Chris Meduri.
At this point, I was done, but Dave added the reason for my interest/concern with the milkweed:
Monarch butterflies only feed on milkweed, and about 80% of the population has been lost in the last 10-15 years. They are not on the endangered species list, but that is why the milkweeds are important.
Vic: Old Business: We all got the email about the trailer park. They are allowed to bring trailers in and out, especially if people have their house destroyed. About the pads that have been dug out--they want to expand the area available for people who are bringing their trailers in.
John Festa: There was an Ohio Supreme Court ruling about this.
Vic: It costs them about $4,000 per trailer to get rid of a trailer. There are 275 lots there. If they wanted to expand, there would be a problem.
Jan Oros: With Mantua Center Road being closed, we are seeing heavy truck traffic on Wayne Road. Are signs going to be posted about that? I mentioned the curve on my property; I am surprised someone has not blown a tire on the broken asphalt.
[Blogger: That is where my notes end. I have not reviewed this to find typographical errors.]
Monday, July 31, 2017
Wednesday, July 26, 2017
New Developments, School Lane, 7-20-17
First, before getting to the blog post, here is a tiny update on the electrical work at the school for the elevator and updated service. I stopped by this morning (7/26/17) and watched for a minute or two. There are two telephone poles and three transformers, a large one on the older pole and two small ones on the new pole, which, as are the transformers, is ours. I did not go around the other side of the building to see where all of that is leading; when it's done, I will go look.
Trustees Meeting:
There had been an executive session before the regular meeting to interview two people who had expressed interest in working with zoning. As I understand it, both had been located by John Dickey. The specifics will be announced at the August 3 meeting, and they will be reported then.
There was discussion about two buildings in Aurora Meadows that came under the purview of the Land Bank, I believe. Jason reviewed the steps required for the process of disposing of the properties. It appears that no one quite knows who owns one of them. The health and fire departments have both communicated with the trustees and are apparently familiar with the two properties.
Garden Club: Sue Skrovan reported on the club's picnic the previous evening and said they would be having a fall bulb sale. The club members are discussing a possible field trip. She thanked the community for coming out and supporting the club at the flea market, where the garden club did well, selling many plants and a few more windows.
Nothing from the LCA.
Mantua Restoration Society: Carole Pollard reported on the flea market, which was successful for the restoration society also. Food was the major source of the success, with Dave and Susan Pollard and Mark Hall manning the kitchen on Saturday. Carolin Newell and Ally Owens filled in with Mark Hall on Sunday, when Dave and Susan Pollard had another commitment. Saturday was busy, but Sunday was slow for everyone. Neverthless, it was a very successful event for the restoration society.
[Blogger: This is a summary, not a transcript of my remarks. The content is what matters.]
Fire Department: John Festa reported that the department has approved just under $195,000 for a new squad.
Jason asked if the old one can be sold.
Answer: Yes, but it is in pretty bad shape. We hope to get $5,000-$8,000 for it.
New Business/Trustee Reports
Bid books for chip and seal have been picked up, and there has to be discussion about crack seal.
Vic wasn't sure why the estimate for crack seal was so high. Preparations are underway; material is being put out in front of the ball field.
Jason: You know about the accident with the truck going into the ditch [on Center Road]. We were working with Travelers and once we called it surface damage, Travelers said that they would not cover surface damage. The damage to the road surface was in order to get the driver out of the truck and the truck out of the ditch. It was caused by the wrecker. It [the cost filed] was also overtime for the crews. [With that explained] everything worked out well.
John Festa, New Business: I am starting to look at the driving section of our handbook. We don't have anything so I began looking at other townships. Some books range from only 16 pages to 120. I will list the points I think are most important and should have something next time.
Also, the material has been ordered for the Civic Center stair steps.
Jason: I have asked Brian Tayerle to save those treads as well.
Vic: I got a call from the electrician today to unlock the school. The entrance service has been OK'd as of today. They figure that in 1to 1-1/2 days they can have it all hooked up. The electrician and I are both working with Ohio Edison and we think we can get power hooked up in one day. We have a sticker for inspection.
Next Tuesday, Ohio Edison should be there and can begin setting the banks of transformers.
John Festa asked about a generator, and Vic said he thinks we will be OK on that.
[Blogger: The School Lane discussion segues in from the discussion about the Taylor property at the bullpen.]
Vic: Chris Meduri has not heard from Mr. May [Mrs. Taylor's lawyer].
John Festa: I have some things about that. I have been doing some thinking [blogger: after a year and a half of strife] about that whole situation and I would like to make a proposal on how to move forward. [Blogger: My notes here contain a string of questions marks, as in wha-a-a-t?].
JF, continuing: I would like to propose that the township do the work over there as a service Friday for the bullpen. This would be for access to the bullpen.
Vic asked about mowing.
John Festa: Then I would offer Mrs. Taylor a revised copy of the license. I thought I could give her an exclusive non revocable license. I think that would show our good faith by the township, and I believe they would appreciate that and it would allow them to use it at their convenience.
I don't think we will get an OK from the board. [?] [For an easement?]
Consider putting a driveway in as [missed a word] service. She could assign that license to the resident and we would honor that for a period of 5 years. Non revocable so they don't have to worry about it.
Vic: Access on township property?
JF: Yes--just like you marked out. If they are OK with it.
Vic: I can lay that out.
JF: I can give you the new agreement. I have softened it up a good deal. I think that is how we should approach it. [Blogger: What caused this semi-enlightenment is anyone's guess, except that it may not be too early to think about an election in two years.]
Vic: We had a bit of excitement at School Lane with Mr. Keller's property.
Jason: North or West?
Vic: North. He had put up No Parking signs which had been taken down. I went and talked to him. We went about 1/2 car length on his property. Then the neighbor put No Trespassing signs on Bill Kelley's property.
Jason asked for clarification.
Vic: The west side. Now the neighbor has turned the signs towards Kelleys' house so it looks as if they can't use the road. [Bloger note: There are two houses on the west side of School Lane, the Kelleys' and the one closer to S.R. 82, owned by James Goggin, his wife, and their daughter Colleen.]
Kathy Kelley: Right in front of our house.
Vic: He thinks he owns the road.
Bill Kelley: On June 19 James Goggin [property owner] came and talked to Kathy and I. About 11 a.m. He introduced himself and said that he and his wife and daughter owned the property and informed us that he had just bought School Lane and he would close School Lane so that we have no way in or out of our property. Now, exactly one year ago, you all got deeds to School Lane. It is a 40-foot right of way. [Bill then gave the dimensions.]
Continuing: We had set up parking for the flea market and voting. We were sharing our property with the township, no big deal. There is room for 16 cars. I spent Friday [making room]. He [Mr. Goggin] threatened to close the road. There was a No Trespassing sign, not signed, on our property. At this point I am not going to remove them.
At this point it is embarrassing because people have been using the parking there. If he closes the road, the Federales will be here. They [Goggins] posted their property as soon as they moved in and fenced it.
[Blogger: If you remember from a previous post, Bill informed the trustees that the rail fence is in the right of way on School Lane.]
Vic: I went to the County and said that someone had closed School Lane. I went and talked to Janet Esposito and the engineer. Janet: We don't sell property. The engineer came out and began surveying. They/I ran out of time. I checked it and it is still Township Highway 715. There is a 40-foot easement/right of way.
The other day Bill Kelley had gotten Beth Pearson (sp?) to survey their property. We sound the pins. While we were there, most of the pins had been found, and Mike McCauley was there and I asked him to find the pins. As it stands right now we have located all of the pins and between [?] the pin at 40 feet down from Bill Kelley's corner down and we located the corner pins and the one at Mantua Center Road. There is a pin every 28 feet now, and Dan Wyznski and I put a stick/stake [?] in. Everything has been surveyed that is School Lane. The fence at the house on the corner is six feet [blogger's boldface] inside the right of way and so is the school bus shed.
Jason: If they want to be like that, we will write them a letter and that they have to move their fence.
Bill Kelley: Saturday and Sunday were an embarrassment. The people coming to the flea market were wondering who the idiots were who had put up the contradictory signs.
We don't want to cause an incident. When people came up the road they were confused and read the signs and then turned around so the passenger could read the signs.
Jason asked a question about that.
Kathy Kelley: He thinks he owns the property.
Jason: Did anyone come out [while you were doing that?]
Vic: Not that I know of.
Bill: His fence is ten feet inside the easement. Putting the fence in caused the controversy for the primary in 2016. The fence installers were blocking the road, which on that day was one way. And the gas company was there because they were trying to determine what went on with the gas line. So here was this traffic jam on Election Day.
Kathy: The man who has been the source of the issue was not there--he does not live there. Neither was his daughter--she was off at work.
Vic: I will talk to John Dickey and send him to talk to them.
Jason: I want to send them a letter also. You remember the letter we sent to the people on Winchell Road.
Vic: It was quite an eventful day.
Jason: Is Mr. Keller OK?
Vic: He's OK now. By the end of the day, he approved letting us park there. I think the biggest thing was that no one had talked with him about this event. It would have been nice.
What I would like to do is level that all off and plant some grass and keep it mowed and define the property line.
[Blogger: This is a good place to end this post. The next exchange, which involved Amy Janca, is very interesting, in my opinion.]
Trustees Meeting:
There had been an executive session before the regular meeting to interview two people who had expressed interest in working with zoning. As I understand it, both had been located by John Dickey. The specifics will be announced at the August 3 meeting, and they will be reported then.
There was discussion about two buildings in Aurora Meadows that came under the purview of the Land Bank, I believe. Jason reviewed the steps required for the process of disposing of the properties. It appears that no one quite knows who owns one of them. The health and fire departments have both communicated with the trustees and are apparently familiar with the two properties.
Garden Club: Sue Skrovan reported on the club's picnic the previous evening and said they would be having a fall bulb sale. The club members are discussing a possible field trip. She thanked the community for coming out and supporting the club at the flea market, where the garden club did well, selling many plants and a few more windows.
Nothing from the LCA.
Mantua Restoration Society: Carole Pollard reported on the flea market, which was successful for the restoration society also. Food was the major source of the success, with Dave and Susan Pollard and Mark Hall manning the kitchen on Saturday. Carolin Newell and Ally Owens filled in with Mark Hall on Sunday, when Dave and Susan Pollard had another commitment. Saturday was busy, but Sunday was slow for everyone. Neverthless, it was a very successful event for the restoration society.
[Blogger: This is a summary, not a transcript of my remarks. The content is what matters.]
Fire Department: John Festa reported that the department has approved just under $195,000 for a new squad.
Jason asked if the old one can be sold.
Answer: Yes, but it is in pretty bad shape. We hope to get $5,000-$8,000 for it.
New Business/Trustee Reports
Bid books for chip and seal have been picked up, and there has to be discussion about crack seal.
Vic wasn't sure why the estimate for crack seal was so high. Preparations are underway; material is being put out in front of the ball field.
Jason: You know about the accident with the truck going into the ditch [on Center Road]. We were working with Travelers and once we called it surface damage, Travelers said that they would not cover surface damage. The damage to the road surface was in order to get the driver out of the truck and the truck out of the ditch. It was caused by the wrecker. It [the cost filed] was also overtime for the crews. [With that explained] everything worked out well.
John Festa, New Business: I am starting to look at the driving section of our handbook. We don't have anything so I began looking at other townships. Some books range from only 16 pages to 120. I will list the points I think are most important and should have something next time.
Also, the material has been ordered for the Civic Center stair steps.
Jason: I have asked Brian Tayerle to save those treads as well.
Vic: I got a call from the electrician today to unlock the school. The entrance service has been OK'd as of today. They figure that in 1to 1-1/2 days they can have it all hooked up. The electrician and I are both working with Ohio Edison and we think we can get power hooked up in one day. We have a sticker for inspection.
Next Tuesday, Ohio Edison should be there and can begin setting the banks of transformers.
John Festa asked about a generator, and Vic said he thinks we will be OK on that.
[Blogger: The School Lane discussion segues in from the discussion about the Taylor property at the bullpen.]
Vic: Chris Meduri has not heard from Mr. May [Mrs. Taylor's lawyer].
John Festa: I have some things about that. I have been doing some thinking [blogger: after a year and a half of strife] about that whole situation and I would like to make a proposal on how to move forward. [Blogger: My notes here contain a string of questions marks, as in wha-a-a-t?].
JF, continuing: I would like to propose that the township do the work over there as a service Friday for the bullpen. This would be for access to the bullpen.
Vic asked about mowing.
John Festa: Then I would offer Mrs. Taylor a revised copy of the license. I thought I could give her an exclusive non revocable license. I think that would show our good faith by the township, and I believe they would appreciate that and it would allow them to use it at their convenience.
I don't think we will get an OK from the board. [?] [For an easement?]
Consider putting a driveway in as [missed a word] service. She could assign that license to the resident and we would honor that for a period of 5 years. Non revocable so they don't have to worry about it.
Vic: Access on township property?
JF: Yes--just like you marked out. If they are OK with it.
Vic: I can lay that out.
JF: I can give you the new agreement. I have softened it up a good deal. I think that is how we should approach it. [Blogger: What caused this semi-enlightenment is anyone's guess, except that it may not be too early to think about an election in two years.]
Vic: We had a bit of excitement at School Lane with Mr. Keller's property.
Jason: North or West?
Vic: North. He had put up No Parking signs which had been taken down. I went and talked to him. We went about 1/2 car length on his property. Then the neighbor put No Trespassing signs on Bill Kelley's property.
Jason asked for clarification.
Vic: The west side. Now the neighbor has turned the signs towards Kelleys' house so it looks as if they can't use the road. [Bloger note: There are two houses on the west side of School Lane, the Kelleys' and the one closer to S.R. 82, owned by James Goggin, his wife, and their daughter Colleen.]
Kathy Kelley: Right in front of our house.
Vic: He thinks he owns the road.
Bill Kelley: On June 19 James Goggin [property owner] came and talked to Kathy and I. About 11 a.m. He introduced himself and said that he and his wife and daughter owned the property and informed us that he had just bought School Lane and he would close School Lane so that we have no way in or out of our property. Now, exactly one year ago, you all got deeds to School Lane. It is a 40-foot right of way. [Bill then gave the dimensions.]
Continuing: We had set up parking for the flea market and voting. We were sharing our property with the township, no big deal. There is room for 16 cars. I spent Friday [making room]. He [Mr. Goggin] threatened to close the road. There was a No Trespassing sign, not signed, on our property. At this point I am not going to remove them.
At this point it is embarrassing because people have been using the parking there. If he closes the road, the Federales will be here. They [Goggins] posted their property as soon as they moved in and fenced it.
[Blogger: If you remember from a previous post, Bill informed the trustees that the rail fence is in the right of way on School Lane.]
Vic: I went to the County and said that someone had closed School Lane. I went and talked to Janet Esposito and the engineer. Janet: We don't sell property. The engineer came out and began surveying. They/I ran out of time. I checked it and it is still Township Highway 715. There is a 40-foot easement/right of way.
The other day Bill Kelley had gotten Beth Pearson (sp?) to survey their property. We sound the pins. While we were there, most of the pins had been found, and Mike McCauley was there and I asked him to find the pins. As it stands right now we have located all of the pins and between [?] the pin at 40 feet down from Bill Kelley's corner down and we located the corner pins and the one at Mantua Center Road. There is a pin every 28 feet now, and Dan Wyznski and I put a stick/stake [?] in. Everything has been surveyed that is School Lane. The fence at the house on the corner is six feet [blogger's boldface] inside the right of way and so is the school bus shed.
Jason: If they want to be like that, we will write them a letter and that they have to move their fence.
Bill Kelley: Saturday and Sunday were an embarrassment. The people coming to the flea market were wondering who the idiots were who had put up the contradictory signs.
We don't want to cause an incident. When people came up the road they were confused and read the signs and then turned around so the passenger could read the signs.
Jason asked a question about that.
Kathy Kelley: He thinks he owns the property.
Jason: Did anyone come out [while you were doing that?]
Vic: Not that I know of.
Bill: His fence is ten feet inside the easement. Putting the fence in caused the controversy for the primary in 2016. The fence installers were blocking the road, which on that day was one way. And the gas company was there because they were trying to determine what went on with the gas line. So here was this traffic jam on Election Day.
Kathy: The man who has been the source of the issue was not there--he does not live there. Neither was his daughter--she was off at work.
Vic: I will talk to John Dickey and send him to talk to them.
Jason: I want to send them a letter also. You remember the letter we sent to the people on Winchell Road.
Vic: It was quite an eventful day.
Jason: Is Mr. Keller OK?
Vic: He's OK now. By the end of the day, he approved letting us park there. I think the biggest thing was that no one had talked with him about this event. It would have been nice.
What I would like to do is level that all off and plant some grass and keep it mowed and define the property line.
[Blogger: This is a good place to end this post. The next exchange, which involved Amy Janca, is very interesting, in my opinion.]
Tuesday, July 25, 2017
A Major Next Step
Today, a pole was planted at the northeast corner of the school property on Center Road, and the transformers to service the elevator were installed on it.
The pole is 65 feet high and set 8-1/2 feet into the ground. Around 9 this morning, there were at least three Ohio Edison trucks at the site.
An electrician has to come to do something on the building next*, and the Ohio Edison crew will take a half day (I think tomorrow) to finish up their part of the work. With that done, the elevator cab can be delivered and installed.
Jan and I both took a bunch of pictures, and hers (some, anyhow) will show up on Facebook. Stay tuned.
Now, let me add this: At the flea market, we heard the latest cock-a-mamie "report" that the elevator project was done (I think done as in dead).
Wrong. Dead wrong. The project is moving forward, one lurch at a time, but moving forward. As for the bogus "report" above, by mid-September, anyone can come to the school and see the truth.
*Electricity is something I just plain don't understand past the bare rudiments, and I have not seen what has to be installed where. Part of the work will be on the outside of the building in the form, I believe, of service "boxes." None of this starred comment should be considered more than a very, very, rough approximation of what has to be done or what it will accomplish.
The pole is 65 feet high and set 8-1/2 feet into the ground. Around 9 this morning, there were at least three Ohio Edison trucks at the site.
An electrician has to come to do something on the building next*, and the Ohio Edison crew will take a half day (I think tomorrow) to finish up their part of the work. With that done, the elevator cab can be delivered and installed.
Jan and I both took a bunch of pictures, and hers (some, anyhow) will show up on Facebook. Stay tuned.
Now, let me add this: At the flea market, we heard the latest cock-a-mamie "report" that the elevator project was done (I think done as in dead).
Wrong. Dead wrong. The project is moving forward, one lurch at a time, but moving forward. As for the bogus "report" above, by mid-September, anyone can come to the school and see the truth.
*Electricity is something I just plain don't understand past the bare rudiments, and I have not seen what has to be installed where. Part of the work will be on the outside of the building in the form, I believe, of service "boxes." None of this starred comment should be considered more than a very, very, rough approximation of what has to be done or what it will accomplish.
Monday, July 17, 2017
July 6, 2017 Trustees Meeting
John Dickey, zoning inspector, reported on various things, many of which he lumped into "nuisance calls."
There are several court cases regarding zoning.
[Your faithful blogger has notes about reports and notices by the Health Department, Fire Department, and Building Department--but I do not have/did not get information about specifically what was concerned.]
Some of the statutes have changed.
Jason: One of us needs to get additional details on the statute changes. Everything must be done exactly and in order.
First, the Health, Fire, and Building Departments inspect properties. Then we have to put an advertisement in the paper and send a certified letter to the owner. There is a lengthy resolution accompanying this.
John Dickey: There is a certain amount of time to comply.
Jason: There are two properties.
John Dickey: The building department went out with the health department, so those are combined. One of them looks unoccupied, but there is always a vehicle in the driveway and it is always clean.
[Blogger: There was some routine business about the cemetery, the road department, and the state of some of the equipment--were problems with the tractor increasing. Brian Tayerle allowed as how perhaps we should look ahead to an upgrade.
We get an allowance every year from our insurance company, I believe, and it has generally been used to buy clothing or safety related items. That is why the guys have those lime green shirts.
Jason made a motion to do that. ]
In regard to the tractor, Vic mentioned that Auburn had purchased a 2-year-old tractor that is in good condition from a source who upgrades every two years. The cost was $40,000.
Brian commented that the tractor is our second oldest piece of equipment, and Vic added that it was never designed to be a mower: he has welded every brace on iot.
Civic Center steps: Bids were opened. Benner Masonry bid $7800 for the steps and ramp, and Troy Construction bid $7300 for that work.
[Blogger: Another company, judging from my notes, broke this into two sections, one for $5360 and the other for $4800.
Jason said we have a little paper work to look at and suggested doing that before making a decision.
The wreck on Mantua Center Road has been turned over to Travelers Insurance.
[The blog will now pick up on the beginning of public comment.]
Carole Pollard: I pitched the upcoming flea market, now history. No further from me in this post.
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: First, congratulations [to Jason] on the birth of your daughter. It's most important thjat baby and mother are fine.
[Dave then told a brief story about our mother, the first born followed by 6 brothers. It is not included here.]
Dave, continuing: Old Frost can use a pass with the grader. It is not as bad as it was represented a couple of months ago, but it could use some work.
The intersection out here: The State will not do anything because it will not meet their requirements. They will apparently not let the township do anything about it, either. The township ought to be able to do something. In most cases the township can have more stringent requirements than the county.
I have not had time to research it in the ORC. Maybe something will turn up. Maybe this winter I can go through it with a fine tooth comb.
Jason: I contacted Joe di Furia (Regional ODOT) on the crash statistics. He also mentioned possibly increasing a thick white line on Mantua Center Road 4' to 6' back from the intersection. We would probably have to get the county involved. A good time would be when we chip and seal Bowen Road when the county is going to paint. It is exasperating that nothing can be done, even knowing how dangerous it is.
[Blogger: The Robin Park comments and discussion occurred here, followed by Jan Oros's remarks. There was one remark that I am not sure got into the post detailing the exchange between her and John Festa, who interrupted her, talked over her, and then made this remark:
You have made your views clear.
Jan: And I intend to continue to bring this to public attention.]
One more person was then recognized, a young woman, clearly a professional, who had sat at the end of the row where the Robin Park residents were. Some of had been wondering if she was a lawyer for them. She is not.
She introduced herself: My name is Taylor, and I am here from the State Treasurer's Office. I have been working with Jodie Thompson for a while. I am from Twinsburg and thought I would stop and introduce myself.
We have a website that is available to use. It is password protected.
John Festa: If you would like to speak to the group, we can give you time up front.
Jason: I did not know you were coming--I could have put you on the agenda.
[Blogger: Two things--First, why was Taylor not appropriately and professionally introduced to the trustees by the person who knew her? Jason sounded a little embarrassed and apologetic--and that is not a criticism of him.
Second, my notes end here.]
There are several court cases regarding zoning.
[Your faithful blogger has notes about reports and notices by the Health Department, Fire Department, and Building Department--but I do not have/did not get information about specifically what was concerned.]
Some of the statutes have changed.
Jason: One of us needs to get additional details on the statute changes. Everything must be done exactly and in order.
First, the Health, Fire, and Building Departments inspect properties. Then we have to put an advertisement in the paper and send a certified letter to the owner. There is a lengthy resolution accompanying this.
John Dickey: There is a certain amount of time to comply.
Jason: There are two properties.
John Dickey: The building department went out with the health department, so those are combined. One of them looks unoccupied, but there is always a vehicle in the driveway and it is always clean.
[Blogger: There was some routine business about the cemetery, the road department, and the state of some of the equipment--were problems with the tractor increasing. Brian Tayerle allowed as how perhaps we should look ahead to an upgrade.
We get an allowance every year from our insurance company, I believe, and it has generally been used to buy clothing or safety related items. That is why the guys have those lime green shirts.
Jason made a motion to do that. ]
In regard to the tractor, Vic mentioned that Auburn had purchased a 2-year-old tractor that is in good condition from a source who upgrades every two years. The cost was $40,000.
Brian commented that the tractor is our second oldest piece of equipment, and Vic added that it was never designed to be a mower: he has welded every brace on iot.
Civic Center steps: Bids were opened. Benner Masonry bid $7800 for the steps and ramp, and Troy Construction bid $7300 for that work.
[Blogger: Another company, judging from my notes, broke this into two sections, one for $5360 and the other for $4800.
Jason said we have a little paper work to look at and suggested doing that before making a decision.
The wreck on Mantua Center Road has been turned over to Travelers Insurance.
[The blog will now pick up on the beginning of public comment.]
Carole Pollard: I pitched the upcoming flea market, now history. No further from me in this post.
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: First, congratulations [to Jason] on the birth of your daughter. It's most important thjat baby and mother are fine.
[Dave then told a brief story about our mother, the first born followed by 6 brothers. It is not included here.]
Dave, continuing: Old Frost can use a pass with the grader. It is not as bad as it was represented a couple of months ago, but it could use some work.
The intersection out here: The State will not do anything because it will not meet their requirements. They will apparently not let the township do anything about it, either. The township ought to be able to do something. In most cases the township can have more stringent requirements than the county.
I have not had time to research it in the ORC. Maybe something will turn up. Maybe this winter I can go through it with a fine tooth comb.
Jason: I contacted Joe di Furia (Regional ODOT) on the crash statistics. He also mentioned possibly increasing a thick white line on Mantua Center Road 4' to 6' back from the intersection. We would probably have to get the county involved. A good time would be when we chip and seal Bowen Road when the county is going to paint. It is exasperating that nothing can be done, even knowing how dangerous it is.
[Blogger: The Robin Park comments and discussion occurred here, followed by Jan Oros's remarks. There was one remark that I am not sure got into the post detailing the exchange between her and John Festa, who interrupted her, talked over her, and then made this remark:
You have made your views clear.
Jan: And I intend to continue to bring this to public attention.]
One more person was then recognized, a young woman, clearly a professional, who had sat at the end of the row where the Robin Park residents were. Some of had been wondering if she was a lawyer for them. She is not.
She introduced herself: My name is Taylor, and I am here from the State Treasurer's Office. I have been working with Jodie Thompson for a while. I am from Twinsburg and thought I would stop and introduce myself.
We have a website that is available to use. It is password protected.
John Festa: If you would like to speak to the group, we can give you time up front.
Jason: I did not know you were coming--I could have put you on the agenda.
[Blogger: Two things--First, why was Taylor not appropriately and professionally introduced to the trustees by the person who knew her? Jason sounded a little embarrassed and apologetic--and that is not a criticism of him.
Second, my notes end here.]
Wednesday, July 12, 2017
Jan Oros challenges John Festa
[Blogger: This is the first post of the July 6, 2017, Mantua Township Trustees meeting. Instead of marching through it from beginning to end, I am going to present first what I consider most significant and then come back and pick up the rest.
I think you will see why this post has been done that way, and why it is so long. Get comfortable, and get a good cup of coffee. Or maybe a thermos.]
Present: Amy Janca, Barb Herbold, Jan Oros, a contingent of five or so from Robin Park, Larry Leitzow, Mike Lovejoy, Dave Pollard, Sue Skrovan, Carole Pollard
New Business, Trustee Reports, Announcements
John Festa: Only one item. I am looking to get quotes on telephone service. [Apparently there is some dissatisfaction with how we are being billed--or the way we are handling the bills is causing some kind of problem.] I reached out to Spectrum. They can set us up with cable. We are going to have a walk-through and he will provide us with quotes. I may have that before the next meeting.
Vic: You received the e-mail from Frederick May from Chris Meduri. [Mr. May is Mrs. Taylor's attorney.]
Jason: I received it but did not read it. [?!] Oh, yes. He is the attorney. Where do we go from here?
John Festa: We provided them with a license agreement. I think an easement is out of the question. I am not going to tie our hands for he future use of the property.
The information we have been getting from residents is that safety issues are still a factor. For people who are going to us it as a beautification area, consider it as a safety issue. I don't see any benefit for [from?] the township.
Vic: I can contact him and see where we go. Chris Meduri is supposed to come out and meet with the attorney. I don't know where to go from here.
Jason: What I gathered from everything is that there was a lot of hearsay about who wanted what. Chris Meduri asked the Taylors to write up their wishes and that is what this letter is. I agree with you, John, about not wanting to grant an easement. I would have no trouble with a license agreement for the use of the driveway. We talked about 12 feet for the driveway. In this, they are asking for a 12-foot driveway and a 4-foot buffer on each side. I don't know about 12-foot driveways. Most are 10 feet.
Vic: This is a starting point. A license agreement can be altered..
Jason: It is probably going to be more than 12 feet, but it is likely that no one will go right up to that 12-foot mark. For me personally, 12 feet for the driveway in the license agreement would be OK. What are your thoughts, Vic?
Vic: I have laid out a couple of things. I just need to know what we are looking at. I can see the buffer idea so they can drive to their ____ [Blogger: missed that word.]
[Vic described referencing from the face of the barn plus a buffer area.]
Continuing: I think what they are looking for is to be able to get access to that door and stay off of the grass area. I can go back to Chris Meduri.
Jason: The board should probably decide on something and get back in touch with Chris Meduri, put it in a resolution, and then have Chris review it.
Vic: I can tell Chris Meduri that we are looking at maybe 15 feet. Have him look at some kind of license agreement.
Vic will contact Chris Meduri.
[Blogger: Various other items of business were discussed, which I will come back to. The blog will shift now to public comment but will skip to a summary of the comments from the people from Robin Park, with more detailed remarks that John Festa made in response to them.]
Mrs. Pearson [I believe; one person, anyhow, has been a spokesperson for the group. I may not have her name exactly right.] She said that they are making some progress, and one of the things she discovered is that if there were actually units on the empty lots, or on lots where units are vacant and in disrepair, that would come to $6,000 per month. [That figure would seem to be an encouragement for action.]
She asked the trustees what they thought about the residents contacting a local TV station to publicize their situation, but received no answer.
She has asked for but not received information on other things.
John Festa: Whom do you correspond with about the water?
Answer: Through the manager, with little response.
Another woman joined in then.
John Festa: I have to hand it to you for doing things on your own. That is how things get done.
There was more description of the state of affairs with the units.
Jason commented about how zoning applies to mobile home parks. [I was told subsequently that at least some of his remarks were not accurate. I have not checked on that, but trust the intelligence and experience of the person who said that.]
Jason: I agree with John Festa--you are trying to do this the right way and [have not gotten] anything. I think a lot of people are for your cause.
One woman: It is nice that you are telling us that we are going a good job, but it is getting us nowhere. I am not a trustee or president.
Jason: I appreciate your letting us know about this, but since you are a private park, we really don't have jrisdiction. We can look at the issue and say that you have a problem.
[The county commissioners have been no help, either.]
One of the women commented that the use of the Civic Center for a meeting had been offered, but nothing had come of that.
John Festa: This is your 4th time before the trustees. I feel we have an obligation to do something. On Monday I will make a phone call to Chris Meduri and ask him what can be done.
Jason also said he would do all he can and asked about retaliation for their proactiveness. The person who was speaking at the time said she was harassed all the time.
John Festa: The thing of it is that people who live in mobile home parks are on fixed incomes. So if someone harasses you it is not like having an apartment and just being able to move.
Spokeswoman: My father said that the next time they harass me, call the opolice.
John Festa: We don't want to escalate . . . . [!] Let me see what I can do.
Jason summarized the concerns and then asked if there was a lot of crime or drug activity and then suggested contacting the sheriff to determine how often they had to come out and perhaps connect that to a specific unit. With the fire department, they are coming there for drug activity.
Vic commented about the EPA reports and that four times a year the water has to be tested. He reviewed the report and asked how many people they thought lived in the park.
Answer: not much more than 120 or so.
Vic: The regulations are based on how many people a month use water.
The spokeswoman said that if they use over 5,000 gallons a month, they are charged extra, which Vic thought was a lot of usage.
[Things had kind of wound down at that point, or your faithful blogger had gone glassy-eyed. Here is what I would like to emphasize: The trustees not only do not have any jurisdiction over what goes on in Robin Park, but they also cannot intervene or even, I believe, give advice beyond what they have. They have properly couched that as questions about what the residents have done. One trustee has looked at data and made recommendations about how to deal with it. One has basically shown off his knowledge, and one has made all kinds of comforting remarks that have no authority--but they sure are feel-good sound bites.]
Jan Oros followed in public comment.
Jan Oros: I am glad that John Festa is so generous of you [to Robin Park residents] and I just hope you [John Festa] can be so generous across the road. It seems that her only problem is that she lives there.
I know that the safety issues were brought up about the bull pen and that is why the veterans' memorial was not put there. And then it took over a year for the fact that it is a safety problem to be acknowledged--by you and now those safety issues are being used to deny the easement.
[Blogger: At this point, John Festa weighed in, and he and Jan tended to talk over one another. I think most of it is here.]
John Festa: Let's clear the air [Blogger: never happened.]. I am not using that safety issue as my opposition to the issue. That property belongs to everybody. I am not tying people's hands. If I give her an easement and someone wants to cut through the ball park to get to his back yard, I have to give it to him. [BOGUS!] You can't do that. It is called equal protection under the law. [Right. Tell that to the members of the Garden Club, who were treated completely shabbily.]
So I just wanted to clear the air. It had nothing to do about my decision about why the easement has not been granted.
[Blogger: The above is not verbatim, but the brunt of it is: denial and self-justification.]
Jan: But the road has been in place up until the desire to change the bullpen. To me, it was equivalent to an easement because it was use and let use. It seems that it would be a good candidate for an easement. And be and let be and there was never a problem about that little 25 feet and now it has been blown up and these poor people have to get lawyers just because you wanted . . . .
John Festa: You have already expressed yhour opinion with theletter you sent to my house. You have a right to your opinion.
Jan: Yes, I do, and it is probably 90 % of the township's opinion.
John Festa: Well, I only got one letter.
Jan: What did it take for those people to get on yhour wrong side.
John Festa: They are not on my wrong side. [Right. Then what do you call it?]
[My notes say "More confusion."]
[Blogger: The letter referred to follows. It lays out at least part of the controversy over the bullpen and eloquently states Jan's views.]
April 10, 2017
Mr. Festa,
My remarks must be directed to you, Mr. Festa, as the other two Trustees do not seem to share the same --let's say zeal-- that you have for this issue. Your zeal is for, as you say, "taking back township property"--as if to do so is in itself some admirable or significant mark of distinction for you. (To me, if you have to "take back" something, it meanst it was relinquished by you .....)
In the April 6 meeting you comented on the property rented by Mrs. Weber near the bullpen. ou said, I quote: "we have tried to be nice and they have thumbed their nose at us." At other times you have said that you felt you were being generous.
The word nice is described as pleasing, agreeable, even includes such descriptions as virtuous and socially acceptable. I certainly do not see how you have demonstrated those traits toward Mrs. Weber or to this situation. I do not feel you have been"nice" at all. And you certainly have not been "generous." Generosity would indicate a desire to please the other party in some way. I have not seen that demonstrated.
And--I certainly saw NO behavior on Mrs. Weber's part that would be described as "thumbing yer nose at you".
What I saw was a deeply concerned, frustrated, ultra-anxious woman who came to yhou appealing to your sense of decency and common sense,who described the problems she already has with traffic, privacy and safety for her family on the property--problems that this bullpen project will now effect even more. She asked that you put yourself in her exact shoes, renting that same property, under a false premise that she was renting to buy what she thought was the entire property--and it all explodes in her face just because someone (one?) decides to allegedly "beautify" the bullpen. What would you, personally, want to happen if you were in that same situation? I think you would want empathy, understanding, common sense,decency and generosity.
She found none of these in yhour responses!
What help is "beautifying" the bullpen when the result is making the adjoining property not beautiful, probably not sellable, and reducing its property value? There is definitely a contradiction here that is being entirely overlooked: beautify one area to make another worse?
We have asked many times, Mr. Festa, with no answer, what good is a license for use if it can be revoked at any time and for any reason? The license is for appearance only. There is no real substance. It guarantees her NOTHING.
And finally, and I am truly sorry and disappointed to have to say this last thing to you--for 2 reasons:
1.) I am disappointed because you, sir, are an elected official; charged with setting an example of leadership in this township; and
w.) I am truly disappointed because you were the one elected--and I know it means that the majority that elected you is seemingly in agreement with your positions.
That is a very sad commentary to me--that the majority of this township would actually agree that you are handling this property problem with positive leadership and decency. I would challenge that the majority do NOT feel as you do.
As I said, Mr. Festa, I am sorry to say this: that if anyone thumbed their nose over this situation, it was you who thumbed your nose at all the pleas and appeals that Mrs. Weber made to you. As I said, that is a very sad commentary on your leadership.
Mr. Festa, your zeal for taking back township property (for whatever significance it may give you--especially in this seemingly one and only case), this zeal has turned you into a zealot (one with excess of zeal or fanatical devotion; a fanatical partisan) for an insignificant and in my opinion, pointless, cause.
What you have shown us, Mr. Festa, in your actions in this very least case for a very least cause, is that you would do this to every single one of us in this township--and do it both easily and gladly.
A VERY SAD COMMENTARY --or--will that be your legacy? Mr. Festa, this is the Easter season--a time of reflection. I pray you will reconsider your action There are other and better alternatives.
I am most sincerely,
Jan Oros 330-858-8394
4522 Wayne Road
I think you will see why this post has been done that way, and why it is so long. Get comfortable, and get a good cup of coffee. Or maybe a thermos.]
Present: Amy Janca, Barb Herbold, Jan Oros, a contingent of five or so from Robin Park, Larry Leitzow, Mike Lovejoy, Dave Pollard, Sue Skrovan, Carole Pollard
New Business, Trustee Reports, Announcements
John Festa: Only one item. I am looking to get quotes on telephone service. [Apparently there is some dissatisfaction with how we are being billed--or the way we are handling the bills is causing some kind of problem.] I reached out to Spectrum. They can set us up with cable. We are going to have a walk-through and he will provide us with quotes. I may have that before the next meeting.
Vic: You received the e-mail from Frederick May from Chris Meduri. [Mr. May is Mrs. Taylor's attorney.]
Jason: I received it but did not read it. [?!] Oh, yes. He is the attorney. Where do we go from here?
John Festa: We provided them with a license agreement. I think an easement is out of the question. I am not going to tie our hands for he future use of the property.
The information we have been getting from residents is that safety issues are still a factor. For people who are going to us it as a beautification area, consider it as a safety issue. I don't see any benefit for [from?] the township.
Vic: I can contact him and see where we go. Chris Meduri is supposed to come out and meet with the attorney. I don't know where to go from here.
Jason: What I gathered from everything is that there was a lot of hearsay about who wanted what. Chris Meduri asked the Taylors to write up their wishes and that is what this letter is. I agree with you, John, about not wanting to grant an easement. I would have no trouble with a license agreement for the use of the driveway. We talked about 12 feet for the driveway. In this, they are asking for a 12-foot driveway and a 4-foot buffer on each side. I don't know about 12-foot driveways. Most are 10 feet.
Vic: This is a starting point. A license agreement can be altered..
Jason: It is probably going to be more than 12 feet, but it is likely that no one will go right up to that 12-foot mark. For me personally, 12 feet for the driveway in the license agreement would be OK. What are your thoughts, Vic?
Vic: I have laid out a couple of things. I just need to know what we are looking at. I can see the buffer idea so they can drive to their ____ [Blogger: missed that word.]
[Vic described referencing from the face of the barn plus a buffer area.]
Continuing: I think what they are looking for is to be able to get access to that door and stay off of the grass area. I can go back to Chris Meduri.
Jason: The board should probably decide on something and get back in touch with Chris Meduri, put it in a resolution, and then have Chris review it.
Vic: I can tell Chris Meduri that we are looking at maybe 15 feet. Have him look at some kind of license agreement.
Vic will contact Chris Meduri.
[Blogger: Various other items of business were discussed, which I will come back to. The blog will shift now to public comment but will skip to a summary of the comments from the people from Robin Park, with more detailed remarks that John Festa made in response to them.]
Mrs. Pearson [I believe; one person, anyhow, has been a spokesperson for the group. I may not have her name exactly right.] She said that they are making some progress, and one of the things she discovered is that if there were actually units on the empty lots, or on lots where units are vacant and in disrepair, that would come to $6,000 per month. [That figure would seem to be an encouragement for action.]
She asked the trustees what they thought about the residents contacting a local TV station to publicize their situation, but received no answer.
She has asked for but not received information on other things.
John Festa: Whom do you correspond with about the water?
Answer: Through the manager, with little response.
Another woman joined in then.
John Festa: I have to hand it to you for doing things on your own. That is how things get done.
There was more description of the state of affairs with the units.
Jason commented about how zoning applies to mobile home parks. [I was told subsequently that at least some of his remarks were not accurate. I have not checked on that, but trust the intelligence and experience of the person who said that.]
Jason: I agree with John Festa--you are trying to do this the right way and [have not gotten] anything. I think a lot of people are for your cause.
One woman: It is nice that you are telling us that we are going a good job, but it is getting us nowhere. I am not a trustee or president.
Jason: I appreciate your letting us know about this, but since you are a private park, we really don't have jrisdiction. We can look at the issue and say that you have a problem.
[The county commissioners have been no help, either.]
One of the women commented that the use of the Civic Center for a meeting had been offered, but nothing had come of that.
John Festa: This is your 4th time before the trustees. I feel we have an obligation to do something. On Monday I will make a phone call to Chris Meduri and ask him what can be done.
Jason also said he would do all he can and asked about retaliation for their proactiveness. The person who was speaking at the time said she was harassed all the time.
John Festa: The thing of it is that people who live in mobile home parks are on fixed incomes. So if someone harasses you it is not like having an apartment and just being able to move.
Spokeswoman: My father said that the next time they harass me, call the opolice.
John Festa: We don't want to escalate . . . . [!] Let me see what I can do.
Jason summarized the concerns and then asked if there was a lot of crime or drug activity and then suggested contacting the sheriff to determine how often they had to come out and perhaps connect that to a specific unit. With the fire department, they are coming there for drug activity.
Vic commented about the EPA reports and that four times a year the water has to be tested. He reviewed the report and asked how many people they thought lived in the park.
Answer: not much more than 120 or so.
Vic: The regulations are based on how many people a month use water.
The spokeswoman said that if they use over 5,000 gallons a month, they are charged extra, which Vic thought was a lot of usage.
[Things had kind of wound down at that point, or your faithful blogger had gone glassy-eyed. Here is what I would like to emphasize: The trustees not only do not have any jurisdiction over what goes on in Robin Park, but they also cannot intervene or even, I believe, give advice beyond what they have. They have properly couched that as questions about what the residents have done. One trustee has looked at data and made recommendations about how to deal with it. One has basically shown off his knowledge, and one has made all kinds of comforting remarks that have no authority--but they sure are feel-good sound bites.]
Jan Oros followed in public comment.
Jan Oros: I am glad that John Festa is so generous of you [to Robin Park residents] and I just hope you [John Festa] can be so generous across the road. It seems that her only problem is that she lives there.
I know that the safety issues were brought up about the bull pen and that is why the veterans' memorial was not put there. And then it took over a year for the fact that it is a safety problem to be acknowledged--by you and now those safety issues are being used to deny the easement.
[Blogger: At this point, John Festa weighed in, and he and Jan tended to talk over one another. I think most of it is here.]
John Festa: Let's clear the air [Blogger: never happened.]. I am not using that safety issue as my opposition to the issue. That property belongs to everybody. I am not tying people's hands. If I give her an easement and someone wants to cut through the ball park to get to his back yard, I have to give it to him. [BOGUS!] You can't do that. It is called equal protection under the law. [Right. Tell that to the members of the Garden Club, who were treated completely shabbily.]
So I just wanted to clear the air. It had nothing to do about my decision about why the easement has not been granted.
[Blogger: The above is not verbatim, but the brunt of it is: denial and self-justification.]
Jan: But the road has been in place up until the desire to change the bullpen. To me, it was equivalent to an easement because it was use and let use. It seems that it would be a good candidate for an easement. And be and let be and there was never a problem about that little 25 feet and now it has been blown up and these poor people have to get lawyers just because you wanted . . . .
John Festa: You have already expressed yhour opinion with theletter you sent to my house. You have a right to your opinion.
Jan: Yes, I do, and it is probably 90 % of the township's opinion.
John Festa: Well, I only got one letter.
Jan: What did it take for those people to get on yhour wrong side.
John Festa: They are not on my wrong side. [Right. Then what do you call it?]
[My notes say "More confusion."]
[Blogger: The letter referred to follows. It lays out at least part of the controversy over the bullpen and eloquently states Jan's views.]
April 10, 2017
Mr. Festa,
My remarks must be directed to you, Mr. Festa, as the other two Trustees do not seem to share the same --let's say zeal-- that you have for this issue. Your zeal is for, as you say, "taking back township property"--as if to do so is in itself some admirable or significant mark of distinction for you. (To me, if you have to "take back" something, it meanst it was relinquished by you .....)
In the April 6 meeting you comented on the property rented by Mrs. Weber near the bullpen. ou said, I quote: "we have tried to be nice and they have thumbed their nose at us." At other times you have said that you felt you were being generous.
The word nice is described as pleasing, agreeable, even includes such descriptions as virtuous and socially acceptable. I certainly do not see how you have demonstrated those traits toward Mrs. Weber or to this situation. I do not feel you have been"nice" at all. And you certainly have not been "generous." Generosity would indicate a desire to please the other party in some way. I have not seen that demonstrated.
And--I certainly saw NO behavior on Mrs. Weber's part that would be described as "thumbing yer nose at you".
What I saw was a deeply concerned, frustrated, ultra-anxious woman who came to yhou appealing to your sense of decency and common sense,who described the problems she already has with traffic, privacy and safety for her family on the property--problems that this bullpen project will now effect even more. She asked that you put yourself in her exact shoes, renting that same property, under a false premise that she was renting to buy what she thought was the entire property--and it all explodes in her face just because someone (one?) decides to allegedly "beautify" the bullpen. What would you, personally, want to happen if you were in that same situation? I think you would want empathy, understanding, common sense,decency and generosity.
She found none of these in yhour responses!
What help is "beautifying" the bullpen when the result is making the adjoining property not beautiful, probably not sellable, and reducing its property value? There is definitely a contradiction here that is being entirely overlooked: beautify one area to make another worse?
We have asked many times, Mr. Festa, with no answer, what good is a license for use if it can be revoked at any time and for any reason? The license is for appearance only. There is no real substance. It guarantees her NOTHING.
And finally, and I am truly sorry and disappointed to have to say this last thing to you--for 2 reasons:
1.) I am disappointed because you, sir, are an elected official; charged with setting an example of leadership in this township; and
w.) I am truly disappointed because you were the one elected--and I know it means that the majority that elected you is seemingly in agreement with your positions.
That is a very sad commentary to me--that the majority of this township would actually agree that you are handling this property problem with positive leadership and decency. I would challenge that the majority do NOT feel as you do.
As I said, Mr. Festa, I am sorry to say this: that if anyone thumbed their nose over this situation, it was you who thumbed your nose at all the pleas and appeals that Mrs. Weber made to you. As I said, that is a very sad commentary on your leadership.
Mr. Festa, your zeal for taking back township property (for whatever significance it may give you--especially in this seemingly one and only case), this zeal has turned you into a zealot (one with excess of zeal or fanatical devotion; a fanatical partisan) for an insignificant and in my opinion, pointless, cause.
What you have shown us, Mr. Festa, in your actions in this very least case for a very least cause, is that you would do this to every single one of us in this township--and do it both easily and gladly.
A VERY SAD COMMENTARY --or--will that be your legacy? Mr. Festa, this is the Easter season--a time of reflection. I pray you will reconsider your action There are other and better alternatives.
I am most sincerely,
Jan Oros 330-858-8394
4522 Wayne Road
Thursday, July 6, 2017
What Do We Owe Our Neighbors?
The title of this post was the key question in a New York Times article titled "Democracy Without Politics," more of a brief op ed piece than an actual article.
Since I've been spending so much time and attention on our local politics, I have also become a lot more aware of and interested in national politics. I want to tell you, it's turtles all the way down*, because politics is a collection of human beings, top to bottom.
I'm not going to quote the whole article, but here is the context: The author lives in Lyme, New Hampshire, population 1,700. The system of government is the New England town meeting, in which questions and issues are discussed and then voted upon by all who have attended.
People have to understand what the questions and issues are, rather than just accepting what "the party" says, because there is no party--just the residents. "There was just a problem that a community needed to resolve."
In Ohio, township elections have one big thing in common with the town in the article: trustee elections are not partisan, although the first time I ran for trustee, someone called and did her best or worst to get me to say where I stood on the Tea Party. I didn't see how that point of view had much to do with the day-to-day work of running the township, and still don't.
The article described the meeting and the outcome, and then had this to say: "You learn pretty quickly that if you don't treat every washed-out road as though it were your own, you may not like what happens when it is."
The point, clearly, is that we are all in this together--that it's our community, and it should be possible to determine, through thoughtful discussion, the best thing to do.
So why, in Mantua Township, with its tiny core group of people who attend meetings and follow what's going on, is there so much acrimony? Why do one or two or three people think that, without being elected, they should run [a slip of the finger there--I mistyped "ruin" on the first go] the township as they see fit for their own ends, through their own agents? [I wanted to say "minions," but the Despicable Me movies have shifted the meaning of that word.]
Why is it that it isn't possible to disagree without being seen as THE ENEMY, attacked and lied about and even subjected to vandalism?
And why can't we have trustees who have run because they want to be part of what makes the township work, rather than be the agents of someone who wants them to carry out his or her bidding?
This fall, two trustees' seats will be up for election. It seems to me that the key question is this: Who recruited you?
And then go to the Board of Elections and check out who contributed--and how much--to that candidate's campaign. The recruiting has already begun.
*About the "turtles all the way down." In Native American mythology, the world rests on the back of a turtle. Someone asked a woman who was putting that idea forward what the turtle stood on.
She scornfully said, "Ha! It's turtles all the way down." To me, watching politics beyond the township, a lot of the positions that people take on cable news are just as absurd--there is no floor under them, just the party line.
Since I've been spending so much time and attention on our local politics, I have also become a lot more aware of and interested in national politics. I want to tell you, it's turtles all the way down*, because politics is a collection of human beings, top to bottom.
I'm not going to quote the whole article, but here is the context: The author lives in Lyme, New Hampshire, population 1,700. The system of government is the New England town meeting, in which questions and issues are discussed and then voted upon by all who have attended.
People have to understand what the questions and issues are, rather than just accepting what "the party" says, because there is no party--just the residents. "There was just a problem that a community needed to resolve."
In Ohio, township elections have one big thing in common with the town in the article: trustee elections are not partisan, although the first time I ran for trustee, someone called and did her best or worst to get me to say where I stood on the Tea Party. I didn't see how that point of view had much to do with the day-to-day work of running the township, and still don't.
The article described the meeting and the outcome, and then had this to say: "You learn pretty quickly that if you don't treat every washed-out road as though it were your own, you may not like what happens when it is."
The point, clearly, is that we are all in this together--that it's our community, and it should be possible to determine, through thoughtful discussion, the best thing to do.
So why, in Mantua Township, with its tiny core group of people who attend meetings and follow what's going on, is there so much acrimony? Why do one or two or three people think that, without being elected, they should run [a slip of the finger there--I mistyped "ruin" on the first go] the township as they see fit for their own ends, through their own agents? [I wanted to say "minions," but the Despicable Me movies have shifted the meaning of that word.]
Why is it that it isn't possible to disagree without being seen as THE ENEMY, attacked and lied about and even subjected to vandalism?
And why can't we have trustees who have run because they want to be part of what makes the township work, rather than be the agents of someone who wants them to carry out his or her bidding?
This fall, two trustees' seats will be up for election. It seems to me that the key question is this: Who recruited you?
And then go to the Board of Elections and check out who contributed--and how much--to that candidate's campaign. The recruiting has already begun.
*About the "turtles all the way down." In Native American mythology, the world rests on the back of a turtle. Someone asked a woman who was putting that idea forward what the turtle stood on.
She scornfully said, "Ha! It's turtles all the way down." To me, watching politics beyond the township, a lot of the positions that people take on cable news are just as absurd--there is no floor under them, just the party line.
Wednesday, June 28, 2017
Trustees 6-15-17: New Business, Trustees, Public Comment
Jason reported that the bid books were done for crack seal and chip and seal.
Ads would run June 23 and 30. Bid opening will be July 5. There was a question about striping
Bowen Road. The county will do that.
Jason also presented some additional information about the crack seal.
The total for crack seal and chip and seal came to just over $101,000.
There was also mention of traffic control--the people who have the signs and flags while work is being done. [Blogger: I believe their pay is included in the above total, but I am not sure of that.]
John Festa had some comments/concerns about the risk insurance: They are asking for the same things as before, especially the driver's policy. I haven't had a chance to talk with Brian Tayerle about it. There must be a reason why they are asking us to do that. [Note: Those are JF's comments. The lead-in made it sound as if they could have been your blogger's.]
Jason: Our policy manual is outdated--we need to look at it and overhaul it. We may be able just add things.
John Festa: I just wanted to bring up the steps at the Civic Center again. Two people are interested in bidding. I am looking for a third. No bids as yet. [Blogger: Is this how bids are supposed to be gotten? A trustee goes out and finds people?]
I think we should barricade those steps.
[Blogger: This is the second time blocking the steps off has been mentioned. On Tuesday this week, the people who go to Community at the Center used them, as usual. "We ought to block them off" is not an action call or a shouldering of responsibility.]
Vic: People can access [the building] via the ramp.
John Festa: I think the people interested in bidding are from the township.
Vic: New Business: A change order for the electrical at the school. The engineer has revised the drawing. [Vic described the path the wiring follows through the gym and to the outside. It sounded torturously complex.]
The cost will be $4128.
Vic, to Jodie Thompson: Have we received any money from Senator Eklund's office?
Jodie: Yes, we received a direct deposit and I turned it over to Terrie Nielsen. It was $28,989 from the State of Ohio. [Blogger: I may not have understood Jodie's comment here. The money is to the township. Terrie Nielsen, as chair of the Grants and Funding Committee, would of course need to be notified that money had come in--but it stays with the township, if I understand that part correctly.]
Vic: And that will go into the account that you set up? That is from the $140,000 that is ours.
Vic talked about reviewing things to make sure everything is working out all right.
John Festa: I am still talking to Verizon about getting some kind of ______________. [Blogger: Missed that because of some noise. A major concern of trustee Festa's has been Wi-Fi at the school. This may be what he was referring to.]
[Blogger: A motion was made and passed to pay for the change order. At the time, it was so clear to me that I did not put it into the notes. It's Thursday morning, I am reviewing the blog for typos, of which there were several, and asked Vic about the motion. He confirmed that the trustees approved it.]
Public Comment:
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: I wanted to ask about the business of the bull pen this evening. Is that the first time a motion was ever made about all the things that have gone on with that piece of property?
Jason: That's a good question. We have been talking about it so long.
CP: I don't remember that there was ever a formal motion. There was a motion and resolution about the veterans' memorial, but there was not for this. This has been a great bone of contention and Amy and Jim, the people who are involved, always leave before anyone can engage with them.
It seems to me that there is a secretary of this group, and it is Wendy Carlton. It seems to me to be a conflict of interest for you on motions.
Jason: I don't know whether that would be true or not. I know my mom has donated money to that as well as the veterans memorial. I also donated to the veterans' memorial.
[Blogger: I believe that Jason said he had donated to the bullpen project as well; there was a LOT of noise in the room, which made it hard to decipher parts of the recording. My concerns about conflicts of interest were if anything increased when Jason said he had contributed to both projects.]
CP: It may not be a bad idea to get that clarified.
[Note: Last year, when a motion had to be made about an issue between the township and Gary Carlton's mulching business at Mantua Corners, Jason recused himself. I doubt very much that he had any money in that venture.]
Jason: Carole, as far as any group whether by donation or not that wants to donate to the township and the community as far as planting trees, I don't know that it's conflict at all. If you want to try to make it one, I am sure you will.
CP: I just think this has been an untidy process from the beginning. Things that should have been done at the beginning finally come up now, like the leach bed and well and that sort of thing. It has been awkward to say the least.
As far as the open arms for people who want to help the township, the restoration society has had an uphill pull until the last few years when we had money and could begin to swing more weight. We did not feel welcome or as if we had permission to do much of anything.
Things are inconsistent. Years ago there was an accusation about the good old boys' system, and it seems that that is still true.
[Blogger: When that accusation was made, Vic and Mark were the trustees and Steve Oros had just died. When the comment was made, it was completely untrue. It looks true now to me.]
Matt Parsons, Wayne Road: John, you were talking about the risk insurance. The driver's policy. The reason they are asking for that is that if one of the township drivers gets into an accident that is litigated, not only the driver but also the township would be liable. The litigation would expand. It [the risk insurance/driver's policy] is something that would cover your risk.
[FYI: Matt is a litigation specialist for Travelers Insurance Company. I think he said that when he began, but I did not write it down.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: At the last meeting, Nick and Linda Ehlert brought up concerns about the intersection. Nick said that it ranks 126th in state for danger. I did some homework and will not say that these figures are precise, but I counted every intersection in Portage County [that is like the one at Center Road and SR 82--a secondary road and a main highway.] Portage County has 126 such intersections. I also counted Preble County, which has 134 such intersections; Scioto, 165; Wood, ion northwest Ohio, 186; Muskingum, 225. The average number of intersections in the five counties is 167 intersections with secondary roads and main highways. I eliminated mostly city counties (like Cuyahoga, for example). That eliminated 7 counties, leaving 83 counties that I counted, with an average of 167 intersections per county. The equivalent is 13,177 intersections. This is a rough estimate because I did not have time to count every intersection. With nearly 14,000 intersections in the state, we came up at 126th in the state [for danger.].
I think it is time to turn and face the reality that this is a dangerous intersection for the people using it. I think it is timer to get over the reluctance to say that it is dangerous. I think it is time, Jason, to take the money and put up a sign that says Dangerous Intersection and if the flashing red lights can be attached to the sign, that would be a big help. That would be more helpful.
Jason: I did not post anything. I _______________ it. [Blogger: Missed that word.] That is a state sign, [not ours]. I have offered to send you my lengthy [e-mail] conversations with ODOT. We don't own the intersection.
Dave: Center Road is our road.
Jason: The only intersections we own are township to township. We don't own those signs. We can go around in circles. I agree that it is not a safe intersection. They pulled all of the statistics at our request and how the crashes occur.
It does not meet the requirements for a signal there. Or for a flashing stop sign. So they moved the intersection sign, but the intersection does not meet the requirements for the lighting.
The residents did not want the north bank cut back. ODOT did not want to bother the residents.
I posed that argument to the home owners, and they understood, but did not want to lose the trees. ODOT could have cut the bank and removed the trees but did not want to do that.
Saying that I put that sign there--I didn't. In one of the e-mails to ODOT, I got rather stern.
Dave: You have been point man on this, and saice the first of June there have been three accidents. To demonstrate your concern, maybe you need to contact them again and push and ask why they can not put signs there.
Jason: I would be more than happy to contact them again.
Dave: Chamberlin Road is 148th in danger in the state, and Frost Road does not have a ranking. Once Frost gets widened and paved, it will become more dangerous. It seems as if the number of accidents has increased over the last three years. I didn't mean to imply that you had not done anything--I saw the work you did.
About Jim and Amy: The problem they are having with the trees is partly the township and partly their problem [because of the way things were handled.]
[Blogger: My notes have the brackets, which kind of unusual. Dave may have stopped at "problem," and I added the next phrase, bracketed because it was my clarifying addition.
At this point the trustees paused to pay the bills and there was an executive session after that. I went home.
Ads would run June 23 and 30. Bid opening will be July 5. There was a question about striping
Bowen Road. The county will do that.
Jason also presented some additional information about the crack seal.
The total for crack seal and chip and seal came to just over $101,000.
There was also mention of traffic control--the people who have the signs and flags while work is being done. [Blogger: I believe their pay is included in the above total, but I am not sure of that.]
John Festa had some comments/concerns about the risk insurance: They are asking for the same things as before, especially the driver's policy. I haven't had a chance to talk with Brian Tayerle about it. There must be a reason why they are asking us to do that. [Note: Those are JF's comments. The lead-in made it sound as if they could have been your blogger's.]
Jason: Our policy manual is outdated--we need to look at it and overhaul it. We may be able just add things.
John Festa: I just wanted to bring up the steps at the Civic Center again. Two people are interested in bidding. I am looking for a third. No bids as yet. [Blogger: Is this how bids are supposed to be gotten? A trustee goes out and finds people?]
I think we should barricade those steps.
[Blogger: This is the second time blocking the steps off has been mentioned. On Tuesday this week, the people who go to Community at the Center used them, as usual. "We ought to block them off" is not an action call or a shouldering of responsibility.]
Vic: People can access [the building] via the ramp.
John Festa: I think the people interested in bidding are from the township.
Vic: New Business: A change order for the electrical at the school. The engineer has revised the drawing. [Vic described the path the wiring follows through the gym and to the outside. It sounded torturously complex.]
The cost will be $4128.
Vic, to Jodie Thompson: Have we received any money from Senator Eklund's office?
Jodie: Yes, we received a direct deposit and I turned it over to Terrie Nielsen. It was $28,989 from the State of Ohio. [Blogger: I may not have understood Jodie's comment here. The money is to the township. Terrie Nielsen, as chair of the Grants and Funding Committee, would of course need to be notified that money had come in--but it stays with the township, if I understand that part correctly.]
Vic: And that will go into the account that you set up? That is from the $140,000 that is ours.
Vic talked about reviewing things to make sure everything is working out all right.
John Festa: I am still talking to Verizon about getting some kind of ______________. [Blogger: Missed that because of some noise. A major concern of trustee Festa's has been Wi-Fi at the school. This may be what he was referring to.]
[Blogger: A motion was made and passed to pay for the change order. At the time, it was so clear to me that I did not put it into the notes. It's Thursday morning, I am reviewing the blog for typos, of which there were several, and asked Vic about the motion. He confirmed that the trustees approved it.]
Public Comment:
Carole Pollard, Allyn Road: I wanted to ask about the business of the bull pen this evening. Is that the first time a motion was ever made about all the things that have gone on with that piece of property?
Jason: That's a good question. We have been talking about it so long.
CP: I don't remember that there was ever a formal motion. There was a motion and resolution about the veterans' memorial, but there was not for this. This has been a great bone of contention and Amy and Jim, the people who are involved, always leave before anyone can engage with them.
It seems to me that there is a secretary of this group, and it is Wendy Carlton. It seems to me to be a conflict of interest for you on motions.
Jason: I don't know whether that would be true or not. I know my mom has donated money to that as well as the veterans memorial. I also donated to the veterans' memorial.
[Blogger: I believe that Jason said he had donated to the bullpen project as well; there was a LOT of noise in the room, which made it hard to decipher parts of the recording. My concerns about conflicts of interest were if anything increased when Jason said he had contributed to both projects.]
CP: It may not be a bad idea to get that clarified.
[Note: Last year, when a motion had to be made about an issue between the township and Gary Carlton's mulching business at Mantua Corners, Jason recused himself. I doubt very much that he had any money in that venture.]
Jason: Carole, as far as any group whether by donation or not that wants to donate to the township and the community as far as planting trees, I don't know that it's conflict at all. If you want to try to make it one, I am sure you will.
CP: I just think this has been an untidy process from the beginning. Things that should have been done at the beginning finally come up now, like the leach bed and well and that sort of thing. It has been awkward to say the least.
As far as the open arms for people who want to help the township, the restoration society has had an uphill pull until the last few years when we had money and could begin to swing more weight. We did not feel welcome or as if we had permission to do much of anything.
Things are inconsistent. Years ago there was an accusation about the good old boys' system, and it seems that that is still true.
[Blogger: When that accusation was made, Vic and Mark were the trustees and Steve Oros had just died. When the comment was made, it was completely untrue. It looks true now to me.]
Matt Parsons, Wayne Road: John, you were talking about the risk insurance. The driver's policy. The reason they are asking for that is that if one of the township drivers gets into an accident that is litigated, not only the driver but also the township would be liable. The litigation would expand. It [the risk insurance/driver's policy] is something that would cover your risk.
[FYI: Matt is a litigation specialist for Travelers Insurance Company. I think he said that when he began, but I did not write it down.]
Dave Pollard, S.R. 82: At the last meeting, Nick and Linda Ehlert brought up concerns about the intersection. Nick said that it ranks 126th in state for danger. I did some homework and will not say that these figures are precise, but I counted every intersection in Portage County [that is like the one at Center Road and SR 82--a secondary road and a main highway.] Portage County has 126 such intersections. I also counted Preble County, which has 134 such intersections; Scioto, 165; Wood, ion northwest Ohio, 186; Muskingum, 225. The average number of intersections in the five counties is 167 intersections with secondary roads and main highways. I eliminated mostly city counties (like Cuyahoga, for example). That eliminated 7 counties, leaving 83 counties that I counted, with an average of 167 intersections per county. The equivalent is 13,177 intersections. This is a rough estimate because I did not have time to count every intersection. With nearly 14,000 intersections in the state, we came up at 126th in the state [for danger.].
I think it is time to turn and face the reality that this is a dangerous intersection for the people using it. I think it is timer to get over the reluctance to say that it is dangerous. I think it is time, Jason, to take the money and put up a sign that says Dangerous Intersection and if the flashing red lights can be attached to the sign, that would be a big help. That would be more helpful.
Jason: I did not post anything. I _______________ it. [Blogger: Missed that word.] That is a state sign, [not ours]. I have offered to send you my lengthy [e-mail] conversations with ODOT. We don't own the intersection.
Dave: Center Road is our road.
Jason: The only intersections we own are township to township. We don't own those signs. We can go around in circles. I agree that it is not a safe intersection. They pulled all of the statistics at our request and how the crashes occur.
It does not meet the requirements for a signal there. Or for a flashing stop sign. So they moved the intersection sign, but the intersection does not meet the requirements for the lighting.
The residents did not want the north bank cut back. ODOT did not want to bother the residents.
I posed that argument to the home owners, and they understood, but did not want to lose the trees. ODOT could have cut the bank and removed the trees but did not want to do that.
Saying that I put that sign there--I didn't. In one of the e-mails to ODOT, I got rather stern.
Dave: You have been point man on this, and saice the first of June there have been three accidents. To demonstrate your concern, maybe you need to contact them again and push and ask why they can not put signs there.
Jason: I would be more than happy to contact them again.
Dave: Chamberlin Road is 148th in danger in the state, and Frost Road does not have a ranking. Once Frost gets widened and paved, it will become more dangerous. It seems as if the number of accidents has increased over the last three years. I didn't mean to imply that you had not done anything--I saw the work you did.
About Jim and Amy: The problem they are having with the trees is partly the township and partly their problem [because of the way things were handled.]
[Blogger: My notes have the brackets, which kind of unusual. Dave may have stopped at "problem," and I added the next phrase, bracketed because it was my clarifying addition.
At this point the trustees paused to pay the bills and there was an executive session after that. I went home.
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